Zali Steggall Interview

An exciting interview for you today as we sit down with Australia's first ever individual Winter Olympic medallist in Zali Steggall to talk about her amazing career. From her early days growing up in France and nearly skiing for them in competitions to the days of Australian winter sports where there wasn't even enough funding to pay for excess baggage, it's one of our most diverse and entertaining interviews yet. Ben even gets a tad excited and 'fanboys' throughout it, meaning you will have to enjoy it even more along with Ben as you listen along!

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Please note this is an automated transcript that may contain errors.

BEN WATERWORTH: Hello and welcome once again to Off The Podium, An Olympics Podcast as we bring you yet another one of our special episodes, our interview series, and we speak to past, present, and I guess future Olympians too, because given Colin, myself and Jared are all future Olympians. But very excited right now to have this guest on our show, and this is kind of a bit of internal fanboying going on for this interview. Zali Steggall, she is an Australian skier in the alpine skiing discipline, focusing mainly on the slalom event, an event that she did win bronze in Nagano in 1998. And as you'll find out throughout this interview, I guess for some of our listeners, particularly outside of Australia, those in Canada might be thinking, well, so what? She won bronze. You know, that's not that special. For Australia, it is incredibly special, because this was the very first winter Olympic medal won by an individual, the very first winter Olympic medal won by a female athlete from Australia. And really, as you'll find out in this interview, set a new standard for Olympic sports, winter Olympic sports moving forward in this country. And it's an incredible story to hear Zali talk about just where Olympic winter sports were in this country when she first entered the arena, and to where they are today. And it certainly is a very fascinating, wide-ranging chat. And as I said, fanboying, I watched this live when I was 11 years old, and remember it very fondly to this day. And you will find out that I still have this on VHS. I still watch it every now and then. And certainly one of my favourite sporting moments growing up, and one that, you know, it's amazing that I'm here speaking, well, I'm about to at least speak, to Zali Steggall. And you don't want to hear me speak anymore. You want to hear Zali. So without further ado, here is the Off The Podium interview with 1998 Winter Olympic medallist, Zali Steggall. It's a huge pleasure right now to be able to welcome our next guest to this show. She became the first individual Australian athlete to win a winter Olympic medal back in 1998 in Slalom, when she won bronze in Nagano. And not only has she had an outstanding career in the sport of skiing, she's also now got an even more outstanding career in the legal firm practice, just doing great guns out there in the world. Please welcome to the programme today, Zali Steggall. Zali, huge honour to have you here on the show today.

ZALI STEGGALL: Oh, thank you. Thank you for having me.

BEN WATERWORTH: It's, I just mentioned to you off air, it's a bit of a fanboy moment for me to be able to do this. You know, it's an honour. I mean, it's kind of also crazy that in prepping for this interview to realise that next year will be 20 years since you won that bronze medal. I mean, that's kind of scary, is it not, to think that it's been two decades now?

ZALI STEGGALL: It is. And it's amazing. I think when you're growing up, so much of, you know, I think your childhood goes sort of slowly, in a sense, so that sort of, you know, you're a kid for a long time in your mind. And look, it felt like it was such a long journey to get to the top. And then those years where it all came together for me with Nagano and then the World Champs. And to think that that's been 20 years ago and that, you know, it was pretty much 20 years in the making and it's been 20 years since. So it is quite amazing how time flies. But look, there's certainly great turning points in my life.

BEN WATERWORTH: Well, you had such an interesting upbringing, I guess, because I know kind of when you won the medal and sort of the World Championships, it was always kind of touted, like, you know, this girl from Manly has gone on. And, you know, anyone who's listening to this, who might be outside of Australia and not know much, you know, Manly, beautiful beaches, beautiful part of Sydney. And, you know, it's a great story, a girl from Manly going on to win a Winter Olympic medal. But, of course, you grew up, you know, from a very young age in France where I'm guessing, you know, living in the French Alps, you're kind of surrounded by snow. So, you know, skiing, I guess, therefore is part of life, whereas in Manly, it's not really going to be that much part of life. I mean, is that what drew you then to skiing, kind of that lifestyle in the French Alps?

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, I was a very sporty kid, to be fair. I was very competitive and pretty much every sport I touched, I got good at because I was very athletic and then very determined to win. You know, I had that mongrel in me. So, look, I did try a lot of different sports, but my parents went to live in the French Alps when I was four. And we stayed there for about 10 years till I was 14. And then when we left as a teenager, I was very much at that turning point in the skiing career where I had skied in the under 15, sort of junior ranks until then. But once you turned 15, you became sort of, you went into sort of the international rankings and you had to ski for your nationality. And that was the turning point where my parents sort of felt that it was time to come back to Australia and ski for Australia. And of course, that sort of meant, you know, it sort of... And I don't know if they quite realised just, you know, what it was going to mean and how much travel and the commitment it was going to take. But look, I had that, I was lucky to have that upbringing of living in the ski resort where it was a natural choice just as for a manly kid, it's a natural choice to go maybe into surfing or swimming. Yeah. It's possibly a little easier. Yeah.

BEN WATERWORTH: And I mean, you mentioned being a sporting family as well. Obviously, your grandfather playing for the Wallabies, Zeke, I mean, pretty handy snowboarder in his own right. I mean, what were some of the other sports then, I guess, that you sort of were trying? Was it a case of what sports did I not try when I was growing up?

ZALI STEGGALL: It was a bit that way. Look, I think maybe the younger sister syndrome as well, but I was pretty keen to take on my brother on pretty much everything. So look, growing up in France, I used to do cross-country running, I did tennis, I did judo, I did swimming, I did windsurfing quite competitively, actually right up until when I was 14. I actually came third at the French Championships in windsurfing. So I definitely did have that. I have a very, very competitive, even figure skating, ice skating, would you believe, which thankfully I got told when I was about nine that maybe I was going to become a bit too big for that. But yeah, look, I was very, very athletic, very competitive and really lucky that, look, my parents are very keen sports people, very active in their own lives with a sports in history anyway. My grandfather and my father played at premiership level in rugby as well. So they were very keen on the whole idea that they encourage their kids to have a go and facilitate whatever it is that we were keen in. So when Zeke went from skiing to snowboarding, they really supported that. And then it was always about just making sort of sport, participating in top level sport is for when you're young, you can't really put it off for most sports. So they were really keen to facilitate that sort of opportunity to follow your dream. And so I was very lucky in that sense that they could do that.

BEN WATERWORTH: Well, you mentioned obviously when you were 15 about how you had to ski for your country of birth. I mean, I believe you were actually a member of the French junior skiing team at one point. I mean, was that ever an option that I guess if you, I suppose you would have to become a French citizen, would you not? I mean, was there that option that you could have skied for France instead of Australia?

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, it was there. I was top three in France. And so there was the offer that if I stayed skiing in France, that I had to sign up, that they would keep paying for me and take me on board as a French kid. But when I turned 18, I needed to change my nationality in France. That was something that was a bit too big a commitment for mum and dad. I don't think they'd quite, they couldn't quite see that that was beyond what the plan had sort of been. And so they didn't think that that was sort of a commitment we could make at that time. And look, I don't think anymore, we didn't really have a plan at that point that where was it going to go? And we didn't really know what skiing in Australia was going to be like. So how to develop the racing world or what support there was. So it was all a bit of a leap of faith when we then we came back and sort of I started skiing for Australia and working out the system. And look, it took me a couple of years, if it took me a few years to work out coaching and travel and putting in place the support network that you need, which I automatically had in France, but that's part of the learning curve as well of having to be a bit more hands-on in that sort of coaching structure and your team structure around you. But look, yeah, I mean, you probably wouldn't know this, but there's actually a half-Australian girl that lives in France, Tessa Whirly, who's actually lived in France all her life. I think she's got a French mum and an Australian dad, but she's recently won the World Championship from Giant Fire Emblem. So see, there are a lot of people who live abroad.

BEN WATERWORTH: Fantastic, fantastic. That's what we want to hear. We want to keep hearing about this success out there, because I mean, it's, as you were kind of mentioning about when you come back to Australia and not knowing, because I mean, this is obviously, you know, late 80s leading into the early 90s at this point. And, you know, Australia at this point never even won a winter Olympic medal. And I can't imagine that, you know, when you're learning and getting these coaches and everything about just the differences that you would feel skiing in Australia to compare to no doubt all that, you know, background funding and everything they've got in France. Did that become a real shock to you growing up then in Australia and getting used to the Australian system of things when you were used to it all in France?

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, it was definitely a steep learning curve. Like I came back to Australia, I was 14, UK at school, so I had to get used to schooling in English, which was very different. Had to get used to living in a city compared to a mountain ski resort. And then all of a sudden had to travel down from, you know, I went to Queenwood and Northern Beaches in Sydney, and all of a sudden I had to travel down every weekend to the Snow to Perish a Race Club and found that, you know, we didn't really have regional teams or the national team was really only a men's team at the time. And as a 15-year-old, I won pretty much my first races against all the senior girls. So that was a bit of a shock as well that I wasn't, you know, I shouldn't have been winning. There should have been older girls better than me. So again, sort of that high-riding was swiveled around. And I went from a system in France where I had fitness coaches in the off season and I had good equipment and all that to, all of a sudden I'd be catching the bus home from school, you know, to Manly and going to Manly Oval and sort of setting myself from drills and doing my training on my own or finding, you know, I found an athletics coach and I found a weights coach. And it was a bit trial and error for many years. So I sort of attribute that, that it took me about seven years to sort of crack it in terms of getting, you know, from a junior ranks. And it probably took me a little bit longer to get to the top because I had to really persevere through, you know, there just wasn't much funding at the time either. So you really didn't have much, you know, no national teams to go overseas in terms of full-time coaches and stuff like that. So it was trial and error, but I always do put down that it was such a steep learning curve, and I had to be so hands-on in that process that it definitely made me own the result, that I was very involved. There was no spoilt athlete with everything being done for her. So I had some amazing adventures of a 17, 18-year-old stuck in Europe. And what kids don't realise these days is before the era of mobile phones and Internet, so you were very much out there on your own, out of communication. So very different experience. I look back on it now and it's such a different experience to what you had these days with the Internet and there's so much more connected. It would make so many things so much easier from a travel point of view whereas, and studying. I quit halfway through my HSC to go to my first Olympics. I used to study by faxing my time at home, getting to a hotel and having to hand over the fax number to send stuff back to once I was at uni again. And kids think they won't have fax. That would be unheard of.

BEN WATERWORTH: That's crazy. That's crazy to think that. And I mean, it's so... This is where I think like your career is so fascinating with all these aspects because, you know, we have a large contingent of our listeners, Zali, are from Canada because one of our co-hosts is Canadian and he's sort of co-doing these interviews with me, but also interviewing Canadian athletes. And obviously for Canadians, you know, we're talking about winter sports. For them, this is, to us, like, I guess what swimming is and sort of our summer sport. So it's kind of the reverse of what they're used to. And this is why, you know, it's just, it's so fascinating everything that you're talking about and going through there because I can also imagine then when you're competing in these events, sort of even in the lead up to your first Olympics in 92, it's that they're seeing an Australian competing in a sport which is dominated by, you know, the Europeans, you know, the Americans, the Canadians. And does that, how does that work for you? Do they look at you differently? Do they think, oh, she's just an Australian, she's not going to threaten us. And does that help you kind of going in as an underdog or are you kind of still looked at respected, I guess, in a way, because it's like, well, we don't know what she's going to do. She grew up in France. She's got this, you know, European mentality. How does that work in those early days?

ZALI STEGGALL: Well, it was that mix in the sense that you're not really expected to be a threat because the biggest countries like Australia don't really produce pop-out bind skiers. Especially in those days, there really hadn't been much from the Southern Hemisphere. So we'd had a few skiers, you know, like Stevie Lee and Malcolm Milne, but it wasn't a consistent thing. So it was one of those, no, there wasn't that expectation. But because I had grown up in Europe, I certainly put the expectation on myself. And I considered myself to be, I don't think I ever thought of myself as European versus Australian. I just considered myself to be a skier and a worldly skier. I was in my element over there. And look, I spoke, you know, fluent French, I speak fluent French, I spoke German, so I was at home on the circuit with the other girls. So it's not like I was isolated, you know, with the language barrier. But the big difference for the European and North American girls compared to me was they got to go home. So in between races, you know, they'd go home for Christmas, they'd go and do training camps. And if you've had a bad race, to be able to go home and recalibrate, go back to training, you know, get a bit of support, family and friends, it really makes a huge difference. For me, that was probably the biggest differentiator between the other girls and me was that I had nowhere to go. You know, I'd go back to where I grew up in France or go back to Austria, and you'd go back to your sort of your accommodation for the season, little apartment. And you just, you currently only had your coaches and the rest of the team around you. You never had family, friends. So it was just much, much harder to find a balance while you were over there. And in those days, you know, TV was all in Austria, all in German, everything was in Austrian. There was a treat if you could find an English, a movie in English. And it's not like it's like now where you've got the internet and Facebook and you've got all those, all the social media means to stay connected so that they wouldn't have that isolation. And so like, because one of the factors that I found tremendously hard was the loneliness of the circuit, because I had great friends on the circuit and the girls were, you know, great friends in the German team and French team and US team. But it's not, you know, I didn't get to go home the way they did. So they're the aspects that probably were the hardest. But I had known all the girls for so many years and like the French girls, I'd grown up with them. So I wasn't this unknown Australian that's sort of, you know, tropical, they kind of knew me. And as soon as you get results, you get respect for the results you produce. So that part of it was, you know, but it takes years to gain respect as well. When you're from a sort of a maybe an underdog nation. And I certainly always thought that, you know, you need to earn the respect and you need to put the runs on the board to get it.

BEN WATERWORTH: And I mean, the alpine sport, alpine skiing, sorry, I mean, it's a fascinating sport in terms of the different categories and the different events. You know, obviously, you know, the super fast, super G, the super fast downhill, right through to the technicalities of the slalom, the giant slalom, you got the combined. I mean, what is it then, I guess, about the slalom that drew you to it? Because I mean, I can imagine that some people would look at alpine skiing and go, I want to go super fast. That's my goal. I don't want to bang into sticks and have the technicality of the precision involved in slalom. Was it just a case you were better at it or there was something more about it that you liked rather than something like the downhill?

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, I find the best way of sort of explaining it to people is giving them sort of an athletics comparison of why does someone pick to be the 100-metre sprint versus 200-metre sprint versus maybe the 400 or the 1500 or 5000 metres. I think, you develop, some people are better suited to different events. Australia doesn't, we've had downhill skiers, but we don't actually have downhill runs. So you don't really have the training facilities for speed. Speed requires more coaches because your run is longer and there's more safety involved. So you need more coaches on the hill. So that was automatically a pretty big bar for us from Australia because couldn't afford to have two, three coaches on the hill. You know, like you just took more manpower. And then look, in those days, we had, there was a great skier from New Zealand, Anlisa Koberger, who's a great friend of mine, and she was skiing slalom only. So for me, it was an economy of scour by being able to join up with other small teams. So for me, it meant that I could train slalom really well and really easily by training with her. So I actually did all four disciplines right up until the 94 Olympics in Livinghamer, where I still did the downhill and the combined. But at that point, look, I was 19 and I thought, look, I can, it was a very conscious choice. I was already getting my better results for always in the slalom. I wasn't a bad skier in GS and downhill. And ironically, I think, you know, downhill, I'm a big, big tall girl, so the downhill probably would have suited me. But the fact that just the facility of training, the easiness was, the ease was with the slalom. And I got to those Olympics in 94 where I was quite disappointed with my performances. And then I sort of went, well, look, I really got to pick because I don't want to be average at everything. I can be sort of good at everything or I want to try and really be great at one thing. And I guess I had that example of Annalisa where she had won the first ever Southern Hemisphere medal. She won the silver medal in the slalom in Albaville. And I thought, you know what, it is possible. You can do it, but you actually have to focus. You have to pick one and make it be excellent at it. And so that became very much my focus for the next four years was I dropped all the downhill events, all the speed events. I didn't do much GS either and I just did slalom. So it meant that it's a sport where it's repetition. That's how many, you know, everyone jokes about the 10,000 hours and just how much training and how much practise will make you great at something. Well, look, I was training, you know, just nonstop slalom technical. So in your sensory bank where you're practising all kinds of different patterns of gates and steepness and soft, you know, different snow conditions, different gradient on the hills, different types of sets between the gates. You're just accumulating so much more experience that when you get to a race, you're really on top of your game. And so I found that by doing that, I really sort of could be very focused on what I was doing. And I think like a sprinter, you know, why is a sprinter better over 100 metres than 200 metres? You know, that's just the one. It's the distance that suits your physical attributes. And I found slalom suited me. I like the quickness, the reactiveness. I liked it when it was deep and icy and really technical. So for me, that all worked for me. So I think one thing leads to another and the results follow. And so you sort of go down that road. And once you become good at it, then you sort of start to widen your focus again and think, okay, well, should I come back to doing a bit more GS and a bit more skiing? And I probably would have benefited from re-broadening a bit more and having a bit more, you know, a bit of variety in there. But, you know, chicken and the egg, you need to get the results, to get the attention, to get the sponsors, to be able to afford to do it and to, you know, have the programmes. So you need to actually just, I'm a firm believer that you just have to narrow down your focus and really excel at one thing, because then if you get success, then you get the sponsors and you get the support, and then you can start broadening, broadening your focus again and look up, you know, I guess it's a formula that worked for me anyway.

BEN WATERWORTH: Well, I mean, it's something that I definitely want to talk about a little bit later in this interview, but I mean, if you look at, go back to Albuville, your first games, you're 18, the Australian team at that point was only 21 athletes. Yet two years ago, three years ago now in Sochi, we had 61. I mean, in 22 years, that's how far, I guess, winter sports in this country has come and how much it's changed. I mean, you obviously ended your career in Salt Lake, and at that point, you know, back to back Olympics, we'd won medals in and obviously Salt Lake, we'd go on to win two gold. But did you find that, I guess, across your 10-year winter Olympic career, that your first games, 21 athletes, Salt Lake, fast forward where we had medal chances, there was that vibe that changed. And what's that vibe like in 1992 amongst Australia, given that we hadn't had that success, but we were that close, I guess, to achieving it?

ZALI STEGGALL: Look, yeah, the teams, I think, have changed, and our level of professionalism has changed. Like, there's no doubt that back in 92, you know, there were, I think in those days, I mean, Kirsty Marshall was our best hope, I think. I actually know it was a demonstration sport. It was only in 94 it became a sport. So, look, we didn't really have any medal prospects, and everyone was there to sort of do their best. But, look, I don't want to be insulting in terms of it's not an amateurish team, but it's not a team where I wouldn't say the preq of the team is up to scratch compared to the other nations in terms of the competitive nations. Look, I remember the 94 Olympics in Lillehammer. I had to pay the excess luggage to take my skis to the Olympics. From flying from Europe to Lillehammer. So that's the difference, I guess, of the facilities and the focus on what you're really trying to achieve. It just wasn't the same kind of structure. After the 94 Games is when we got a bit more funding, we got a sort of an in-ski institute in place, and we had the next few years a bit more of a professional programme where we had that opportunity of having full-time coaching and actually putting in place some programmes. So by the time we got to the 98 Olympics, we really had sort of three and a half years under our belt of a much more professional set up when it came to certain winter sports. It wasn't, and again, the funding didn't go far enough to cover everybody, but it certainly, we certainly had a much more professional approach to my programme, the Alpine programme, and the aerials programme was definitely a lot tighter. And same for the short track speed skating, because they had won the relay medal in 94. So we did come already, by the time we came to the 98 games, it was already definitely a step up in terms of preparation and professionalism in how the team was there. And we were there, I think with probably more purpose, more purpose to be there for a medal rather than just be there for the sake of being there. And I think then if you look at from year to year, it has only gone up, it's progressed. Like I'm, I've been on and off, and I am again at the moment, a director of the Olympic Winter Institute. So that was, so initially it was a ski institute based out of Mount Bullo. And then that got, after the 98 games, that got rebranded into the Olympic Winter Institute. And that's very much as the winter elite level branch of the Australian Olympic Committee to take over that running of those programmes that were expected to be of medal, or quality performances come Olympic game time. And that's really what paid off. If you look at then the growth of the OWIA from 98, 2002, you've got the two gold medals and a really strong performance. So it's 2006 again with the moguls, the aerials still going strong, the speed skating. You've really got that growth of depth of the programmes. And look, we've just come off a fantastic season overseas. And look, the other thing about the growth of our numbers is there's been new sports introduced into the games as well. So you've got, for example, 98 was the first year that snowboarding was at the Winter Olympics. And in those days, it was just a giant slalom and a half-pipe. Then in 2002, they introduced the... It was in 2006 that they introduced the boarder cross. And then 2010 is when you started getting a few more events. And then last Winter Olympics, we've got all the Slope style events. And now you've got the ski across events. Actually, you already had Vancouver, you already had the ski across events. So the introduction of all those sort of new younger sports does give the opportunity to come to sort of younger ski nations, like Australia, to get in there to... We tend to have that younger athlete population that wants to get into the new, the fun sports that are a little bit more exciting, maybe. And so we have a fantastic representation. I mean, we've just gotten... This year, we've had Britt Cox, who won the mogul. She's won pretty much every event on World Cup and won the World Champs. We've won the half-pipe. We've gotten the... I think it was the bronze at the World Champs for Alex Pullen on the board across. So we've had a fantastic year. Like, it's really set the tone, I guess, for next year for the winter Olympics.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, and there's a fascinating thing with all of these two Zalis. I mean, you mentioned, obviously, Kirsty Marshall. I mean, I remember 94, sort of, all that kind of expectations that went into that, and then it seemed to be, you know, every year. And I mean, I remember, I guess, that bronze in 94. I remember your bronze. And I mean, again, it was such a celebration for Australia. It was so... such a big deal that we were happy with one bronze. And, you know, rewind back to Sochi when we had all this... It's kind of almost now like we go into winter Olympics, almost like the summer Olympics, where there's high expectations and we end up being disappointed. I mean, obviously, we didn't win any gold in Sochi, so people felt disappointed. But, I mean, I'm still coming from this age where I grew up in the, you know, the 90s, remembering how good it was to win a bronze. And I'm thinking, hang on a minute, we've won a couple of silvers and a bronze. Celebrate this, guys. This is the winter Olympics. This should still be such a big deal. It's kind of strange how it's come to that point where we're disappointed we don't win gold now.

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look at that. I must say I don't like that because even for the summer, I think, unfortunately, the way I always viewed the Olympics is you've got 50, 60 people taking the start and you've got three people are going to walk away happy from this day. There's only three. So let me tell you, any colour is a good colour because it's better than no colour at all. So I always sort of felt like, you're so privileged if you can just make it onto that podium, that it really, it's icing on the cake what colour it is, but at the end of the day, it's that privilege of being there because fourth place is sitting with nothing. You know, thanks for coming. So I, yeah, look, I'm not a fan of that focus of what the, you know, that has to be gold, and then that the expectations are so tied to results. Sport is not like, I don't know, a business venture where you invest a certain amount of money and you, you know, depending on what kind of risk, risk assessment you've got as to what the outcome can be, you've got a certain expectation as to what the outcome should be. Sport just doesn't work like that. Sport, you can be the favourite going in, but a little bit of bad luck or somebody else having a great day and people will always pull off the most amazing performances at the, you know, when it counts, when it's a big event. But there is that level of unexpected, you know, you can't predict, you know, the outcome. And so I always find it such a, it's a little bit disappointing when even like for the summer games, just because you go in favourite does not guarantee you the outcome. And to, for the public or maybe the expectation to be so tied to the result, to the medals only, I think it bypasses so many fantastic stories of amazing accomplishments, because people will absolutely, you know, sometimes, I mean, I'm a sucker for, you know, I'll cry at amazing stories of, you know, courage and dig deep. And I love the stories of the people that have fallen over but kept going, or the ones that have, you know, shown amazing sportsmanship by helping out somebody else, or, you know, putting somebody else in front of, it's just, sometimes that success of the Olympics is about more than just being on the podium. And sometimes those other stories get overlooked because of the focus on the medals.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yep, completely agree. And we talked a lot about that in length during Rio last year. And I mean, Zali, I've had this longstanding dream for me to be an Olympian. I mean, clearly, I think I've missed my chance now until curling comes about for me. But I mean, I would honestly, yeah, exactly as you were saying, I would be proudest punch just to make the team. I wouldn't care if I went out there and crashed out of my race and whatever. I mean, I'm sure from a competitive standpoint, I would be somewhat. But the fact that I could always say that I'm an Olympian would just be enough for me. And it's something that, you know, I'm the same as you. I look at these amazing stories. I mean, one of my favourite moments from Sochi was David Morris winning the silver, because, you know, just his reaction and just everything that he did in those aerials. And I mean, we interviewed him a couple of months afterwards. Exactly. And that story and his reaction, it was just amazing. And I mean, he's one of the nicest guys I've ever interviewed and just his reactions and everything from it. And I mean, I think he got bronze, didn't he? Just in the last week in the World Championships. He got silver. Silver, silver, there we go. He loves his silver.

ZALI STEGGALL: And he loves his bronze.

BEN WATERWORTH: He loves bronze, yeah. So it's just, and this is, I will say too, I'm more of a fan, I think, of the Winter Olympics, just because from an Australian, these are sports that we really get to see. And I always find it fascinating. And going back to what you were saying about the different events in, say, the Alpine skiing, I mean, slalom, when do we get to see slalom on TV besides the Olympics? It's just such a unique and fascinating sport to me. And I would rather sit down and watch 16 days of snow and skiing and people jumping over hills in the moguls and just aerials and everything, than seeing people running down a hundred metre track or swimming. I mean, I love the Summer Olympics, but to me, Zali, give me the Winter Olympics any day of the week.

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, the Winter sports have an element of unpredictable, of unknown to them. So for example, people very familiar with Summer sports will always ask, what's your PB? Is there a PB? Do you have a PB? There's no such thing in most Winter sports because you're never twice doing really the same conditions. Whereas the swimming pool tends to be a certain temperature and your lane is this wide and it's 50 metres long and it's gonna be the same. It's still 82. A track is 400 metres. Yes, depending on altitude and heaviness, humidity, it might change a bit, but it's still essentially the same thing. The difference with a lot of Winter sports or all the skiing sports anyway, no two runs will ever be the same. The course, the snow will change from day to day. The hill is different for every race. The setting of the gates of a pattern or the moguls or whatever the event is will be different for every race. And you don't get to do it beforehand. So you don't get to practise it or outpine anyway. You don't get to practise it beforehand. When you get your one go at it, that's it. There's no, oh, I've fallen over. I'll have another go. I'll count my second run instead. That's it. You have to add both times. There's no, there's no second chances. It's all on the line. It's all or nothing. And so I think that's part of the excitement that's always appealed in Europe, that it's just quite, it's exciting because it is, it's an all or nothing sport. And a lot of the winter sports have an element of speed to them, you know, the bobsleigh, the luge, the downhill. There's an element of high speed, which I think is exhilarating to watch as well, but you don't really get that in many summer sports. So I think, look, I think, you know, I mean, I'm a sucker for all sports. I think they're all exciting to watch. I love watching people dig deep and find that extra bit of courage to just lift, lift when they need to lift, and whether it's lift because they've fallen over and stuffed up or lift because they're, you know, trying to win that medal. I love watching that, watching that sort of spirit of seeing who can do it and who can't quite make it.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, it's fascinating. It's just, it really is. And, you know, it's again, going back to what I was saying about how, you know, we've got a Canadian base on this show again, just kind of, and it was fun doing the summer games last year with our co-host Colin, because much, I guess, how we will be next year when we do the Winter Olympics, you know, getting excited, you know, bronze, silver, this is great, or fourth place, finish fantastic top 10. You know, Colin was kind of like that with Canada, like, oh, we got fourth in the race walk. That's good for Canada. Whereas, you know, going back to kind of that expectations, but different perspectives from different parts of the world, which makes the, you know, both versions of the Olympics very unique.

ZALI STEGGALL: It is, and look, I think that's the joy, I guess, of when they split the Winter and Summer Games by having an Olympics every two years, means you sort of have that sort of big event come up. And, Louis, it's interesting and challenging, and look, it changes over time. I think, you know, it's important that sports do need to evolve for the difference, for the audience and the markets and how it works. But it's, yeah, look, it will be exciting to watch, but the Canadians always do pretty well Winter and Summer. I think they always hold their own.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yes, exactly. You're mentioning before, obviously, you know, as I said, your first Olympics in Alba Ville, 92, then obviously went in Lillehammer, and that was that sort of unique period, wasn't it, where they changed the cycle of the Winter Games. So you kind of had two Olympics in the space of, you know, two years almost, and then you're having to wait that four for Nagano, which, you know, in between, you're starting to really make a name for yourself, several top 10 finishes in the World Cup events, your first Australian to win a World Cup event just before 1998. In that sort of four year period, do you feel at that point you're skiing at your best, and this is really leading to you towards having a real crack at an Olympic medal in 1998?

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, by the time I was in that start gate in 1998, it was a make or break. I was 23, I'd been doing it for a while, and look, I did feel like it's my third Olympics. I've had results in the top 10 in World Cup, I've won a race. I'm certainly, technically, physically, it doesn't get any better. Like I was at the top of my game, I was confident in my ability, I had a great team around me, really good coaches, great equipment, my skis, really happy with everything. So in terms of ticking all the boxes, I was feeling like, right, everything is there, it's just up to you now. Was definitely that, I did have that mindset. And look, unfortunately, when the 92-94, the games in Lillehammer, it was just a little bit too soon. At 17 in my first Olympics, it was a great experience to go, but I was still a bit out of my depth. And so it really sort of opened my eyes as to what was going to be expected to be at that next level. I was the best in Australia, but I certainly wasn't quite there as far as world standings go. Two years later, we're still just that little bit too soon. I was still in that process of working out the coaches and the programmes, and we didn't quite have the funding in Australia yet. So I was still, I would describe it as an amateurish attempt, in terms of being there. And I was 19, and that was frustrating because you're sort of feeling like you're getting closer, but you're not quite there. And in sort of 19, you can nearly feel like, I nearly felt like the dream was slipping away in that sense that you're not getting any younger. And really that peak age for a lot of sports, and I think in those kinds of sports, is that early 20 years is very much when it's, you've got everything on your side to make it work. So by the time I got to Nagano, I was very much feeling like I was 23. I felt like I had earned my strife. I had the experience, I had the disappointments, I was learning of having big races go wrong and falling, but I'd also had races go well. So I felt mentally really ready. I'd kicked all the boxes, and if it was going to happen, well, this is where it needed to happen. So I think by the time I was in that spark gate, I was really ready to ski. And then the trick is you can't let all that get on top of you. You've got to find a way of clearing your mind and actually feeling free enough to risk it. Because if you let the expectations or the years of building towards the result weigh you down, then it's not going to happen. You're not going to be free enough to race fast. So you've always got to be prepared to lose it. You've got to be prepared to put it on the line, which is a tough thing to do when it's been a long time coming and a lot of training. But by the time I got to 98, I was ready. It was time. And I was just really lucky that it all came together for me. And amazingly, I've got friends on the circuit that probably got more success at World Cup in terms of top 10 results, but could never quite in their whole careers manage to pull it together for World Champs or Olympics. I never got that big event result, but got more consistent results than I got. So it's interesting when you walk away from a sporting career, what are the results that make you, what do you consider to be a success, and what does it take to look back on a sporting career and think of it as being a great success? I think it's different for everybody, but I was just really lucky that it all came together for me in those years, 1998, 1999. And then unfortunately, I sort of, every sporting career has to come back down at some point. No one ever wants to recognise that, but sooner or later you do. And I just had a series of events where I got a bit of glandular fever, and I had a sort of niggly injuries one year, and coaches changed, and couldn't quite find the right coaches again. And just little things that changed the dynamic or the energy around you, and all of a sudden you're just not quite getting it right, and you're getting a bit older, and you focus supposed to be a bit different. So look, it is one of those reminders that sometimes in your life, everything falls into place. And whether it's sport, or whether it's business, or career, or education, or family, and kids, you've got sometimes you just get those golden patches where it's all great. The lesson is that you've just got to learn to make the most of it. You know, grab that with two hands and enjoy it, because there are always going to be other times. You know, certainly through my skiing, there were plenty of years building up to those couple of years that were great. And then there were a couple of years that weren't so great, that were really hard to handle. And life since hasn't been all roses. You know, there's always been, it's always highs and lows, but it is learning to enjoy it when you've got everything going for you. Take the moment and enjoy it.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, I mean, it's very inspirational there, Zali. Sorry, I'm just taking by the moment there. But it's, I mean, I even remember the event in 98 though, too. I mean, you're sort of going back to what you're saying there in regards to like, each course is different. You don't get to really ski it until you're there on the event day. So many people were crashing out in that event in 98. And it seemed that, I mean, I remember, again, watching it live, as I was saying to you before we started recording it, just the commentators were shocked. They're like, so many people are crashing. This is disastrous. What's going on? I mean, was there something about that course, or was it the conditions? I mean, what was it really that was leading so many people at that moment to just not finish? And when you're seeing this, I mean, is this, does this affect you? Does this kind of, do you have to put that in the back of your mind, thinking, no, that's not going to happen to me? I mean, how does that all work in the lead up to that?

ZALI STEGGALL: You know, look, after the first run, I was in third place, and I think I only had like 100th or 300th to the second before fourth place. I had nothing, you know, there's no lead, there's no safety at all. And you have to wait about three hours before you go back up and do the second run. And the second run is a new set, so it's a new course being set by a different coach, and you get to go and look at it and slide it, but then you have to race it. And they reversed the order in the second run, so all the girls that were behind me in the first run were going ahead of us. And I remember it was a really beautiful, funny day, and it was quite warm, so the snow was getting quite soft. And the second run had actually been set by the German coach. And I used to travel and train with the German coach, so we had been training courses that he had been setting all week as a warm-up. And he actually had, ironically, the girl who ended up winning, Hilda, he was going out with her. But anyway, so that's an aside. But they, she really liked tight courses. So his pattern of setting the gates was always a very tight, turny course, very quick with them, very, very tight. And so we had been training really tight courses all week. So we were very much used to that pattern. So of course, when he set the race, he set what was going to suit the German girls and what we'd been training. So I was just really lucky that that was also going to suit me. And look, I actually didn't know that everyone was having so much trouble because the coaches always, I had a serviceman up in the start with me and I had my coach down on the hill. And they always, they've got the radios and they're talking about how they go. And you get a course report about five people before you're due to go. The course report was, you know, it's tight, it's turning, just go for it. It was, he didn't tell me that people were having trouble on this gate or that gate. All he said was, look, it's tight, you're going to have to be quick and just, you know, it's like in training, it's quick, it's tight, go for it. Because at the end of the day, you've got no time to think. If you've got time to think, you're going to, the race is already over. So it has to happen instinctively. And that course, I remember well, that run was really tight and you absolutely had to be on your toes to stay with the rhythm of the pattern of gates. And I remember a lot of girls were falling because they were, they weren't quick enough. And so as the pattern would catch up with them, they gradually, you know, got later and later and came out. And the snow was a bit soft, so it was, you know, getting a bit rushy, and it was a bit harder to do. But to be honest, I had no trouble from top to bottom. I did that run with absolutely no trouble. I've looked at it, you know, after, and it was fine. So for me, you know, I got to the bottom, not really knowing that so many people have been having so much trouble. So, you know, blissful ignorance.

BEN WATERWORTH: Blissful ignorance. That's a good way of looking at it. I'm sure, I mean, this is a question I doubt you've answered so many times, but I mean, that moment, you cross the line. Obviously, you cross the line in first place. You've only got two people afterwards. As you mentioned, you've got Hilda and of course, the great Debra Campagnoni to come straight after you, but crossing that line in first guarantees you a medal. No matter what, you've won a medal. How is that feeling, Zali? At that point, you are an Olympic medallist no matter what happens. I can't imagine that's even a feeling you can really put into words.

ZALI STEGGALL: I mean, because, you know, the first run is a bit of a dream come true in that you're there, you're in the hunt. You know, after I've been at two Olympics, it's not been great. I've had world champs, not been great. You know, you've finished your first run, you're in third place, you're in the hunt, you're in the race. So you know, you're a contender. But you can't really let your mind drift ahead to, oh my god, I could actually do this, because I had fourth place absolutely breathing down my neck. So there was no point in getting ahead of myself. And then that weight you have where you really have to stop yourself from thinking, you can't think about the fact that this might just happen, you know, this dream that you're sort of all these years it's taken so long. So then that moment when you cross the finishing line, there's just first that huge sense of relief that you've made it to the finish line. Now that you're down. And then it's sort of, look, I do really vividly remember that sense of, I had a real sense of inner quiet in the sense that the crowd was clearly very noisy. But for me in my head, I really didn't hear anything until I turned around and saw the board. And then when I saw on the board that I was first, I hadn't lost any ground, then I could hear the crowd and the noise. And yeah, look, it was a great moment. And then I can honestly say, didn't really stop and think of colour or anything. For me, it was just such a moment of you did it in terms of after all those years, all that training, all the disappointments, so many, so many times where I could have given it away. And I do remember standing before the start of the race thinking, right, if this is ever going to happen, it's going to be now. If I'm meant to have a medal, then it's going to have to be today that I do it. It doesn't get any better than this in terms of preparation and training and everything. So you have to pause that thought from when you first have it first thing in the morning, so you've done your first run, you've waited, you've done your second run, and then finally when I saw the scoreboard, it was that right. I did. It was today. So yeah, look, I was really lucky too. My parents were there, my brother was there, and it was just such a great day. And that's why for me, the colour really was completely irrelevant on the day because the hundreds of the second here or there, you can only control how you ski, you can't control how the other competitors ski. So the fact that Debra and Hilda got that little bit faster down than me, all I was happy with was that I was that much faster than fourth place. And actually, I think fourth place was Martina Ertl, who was a good friend in German skiers. You know, it was, you know, you've just, I always consider it to be so, you're so privileged to be one of the three. Yeah.

BEN WATERWORTH: And I mean, sort of I touched on it before in the introduction, but I mean, for those listening who might not know, I guess, kind of what came with that medal, I mean, the bronze, as I said, you were the first individual medallist in Winter Olympics for Australia, the second ever winter medal won by Australia, the first female medallist by Australia. And to this day, you are the only Australian to have ever medaled in the sport of alpine skiing. I mean, does that sort of, does the history mean much to you then, Zali, that you kind of created that history and held that? And I guess, too, as you were kind of mentioning, I guess your medal win then also spurred more funding and everything along those lines that helped, you know, push our winter programme into what we've got today.

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, at the time, I probably didn't appreciate that. I can look back on that now and realise it is, look, and I've been really privileged that I've been, you know, nominated in the Sports Hall of Fame, and I'm, sorry, inducted in the Sports Hall of Fame, and I'm in the, you know, the Hall of Fame in New South Wales as well. And you do, in that opportunity to make sporting history is great. You know, as I get older and I look back that it's been 20 years, it's nice to know that you've got something like that to, you know, hang your hat on. Look, at the time, it was a big moment. Also, you know, for me, I guess I looked at it from a personal point of view that it had been such a long journey, that to me it was such a vindication of the self-belief I'd had, that it was possible, that I did have what it takes to make it. So it was, for me, the initial feeling was very much that self-indication that I'd been right to persevere all those times. But then, of course, the realisation of what it meant for us as a country, and I think it did spur on the next maybe era of our involvement in winter sports, where we did go into a much more professional set-up of having more funding, and that's when the OWIA got created. And it did create that whole sort of next era, I think, of winter sports. And so it's kind of funny when you sort of then think, oh, we were pioneers of it. And I tend to think that was more the Malcolm Millen era that was the pioneers in skiing. But look, it did mean a lot, and I look back on it now, it's something that can never be taken away. So it is really rewarding to have that and to know that sort of, it's just an amazing privilege to get that opportunity to do it. It's not something that everyone gets to do. And I really appreciate that I was extremely lucky. And sometimes so many things can go right or wrong, but you have no control over it. It's crazy to think that it was 20 years ago. I don't feel 20 years old anymore.

BEN WATERWORTH: Well, it is crazy. I mean, it's kind of what I was saying to you a little bit off air about my fanboying aspect of this, Zali, because, I mean, as I said to you, I mean, I watched this event live for some reason. I wasn't at school. Maybe you have to ask my parents why as an 11 year old, I wasn't at school. But I mean, I taped it on VHS.

ZALI STEGGALL: Oh, it was a Saturday. It was a Saturday.

BEN WATERWORTH: There you go. That's why. Well, there's something there.

ZALI STEGGALL: It was evening. It was dinnertime.

BEN WATERWORTH: That's maybe why I remember watching it. I wasn't at school. But yeah, I mean, I have it on VHS. I've transferred it across my computer now, and I was legitimately watching it in the lead up to this again, because I might not have watched it in 12 months. But I mean, it's just it's crazy to think. And this is, again, that fanboy aspect that 20 years later, here I am speaking to you because I watched that so much. You have no idea how much I watched that after you won that bronze. Because I was so excited for you and so happy at that moment.

ZALI STEGGALL: Well, look, thank you. Well, it's been fun. And it's funny in the different ways in which it maybe touches people, too, in that already after the 92 Olympics, I had people write to me at the time saying, Oh, you know, we've called our daughter Zali after you. We saw your name in the paper. We really like you. And I certainly got quite a few after each Olympics, especially after 98. And so there's a whole generation of Zalis out there, you know, that are about that age. So it is really, look, I've been a bit of a mentor towards that. You know, we've got a Zali who ski races, who's now about 18 or 19. She came along after Nagata. So, you know, it's, yeah, look, it's just, it is an amazing opportunity. And, you know, and I think, look, athletes and sports heroes sometimes get it right and sometimes get it wrong, as we well know. But, you know, no one sets about to disappoint, and everyone is there putting it on the line, trying to do their best. And it is so motivating when you see people, when it all just comes together for people on the day. And I think that's why sport appeals to so many people. What's so moving is that it does. It just, you know, it gets that adrenaline pumping, and it gets, it draws you in because of that, sort of that belief that, I don't know, fairy tales do come true.

BEN WATERWORTH: Very much so, very much so. I always like to ask, whenever we have a medallist on the show, I mean, what do you do with the medal then? I mean, is some people keep it in their sock drawer, apparently? I mean, do you have it on display? Please tell me you have it on display at least, Zali.

ZALI STEGGALL: No, I don't. Look, I don't think I have, with all my kids, I've done a fair few show and tells and speech days and stuff like that. So I do occasionally, you know, if I'm going speaking to schools and stuff, I will take it with the World Chance Medal. Look, no, I've never really put it on display. I've put the odd torches, and I've got a little bit of memorabilia up, but very little, to be honest. Most of my parents sort of hold on to. But look, it's, yeah, the symbol is not in the medal or in the trophy. It's more in the memory.

BEN WATERWORTH: Sure, that's a good way of looking at it. I like that explanation. I mean, after Nagano, of course, I mean, you did go on to further success, you know, more World Cup wins, podium finishes. I mean, going into Salt Lake, that ultimately would be your last Olympics, also a little bit more expectation, I guess, from an Australian viewing perspective, the media, I guess, were probably a bit more focused on you, maybe, than they were four years ago, given that you had won the medal. I mean, did you go into Salt Lake, you know, thinking that you could go better? I mean, how was your mentality going into that four years later?

ZALI STEGGALL: No, I look at it, I had quite a horrible time, actually, leading into Salt Lake, where I was having, I was really struggling with skiing really well in training, really well in lower races, winning easily. But then I was getting to World Cups and I was trying too hard. Basically, I was having sleepless nights the night before, because I would be so worked up and so sort of trying to do well. And then I would get to the race and I'd be nervously exhausted because I had barely slept the night before. And so it was just sort of unraveling. And the harder I tried to hold on to it, or the more it unraveled on me, basically, which is horrible. I look back on it now, and I think there's probably so many other things I could have done to maybe, you know, I need to probably... Look, I think the writing was on the wall that I needed a break. I was so caught up in it that I couldn't... I wasn't free enough to put it on the line anymore. And if you can't... If you're not prepared to lose, you can't win. I know that doesn't sound silly, but it is how it works. And I was so... I wanted the results so badly that you couldn't... I wasn't free enough to ski fast when it came to the big events. And when I got to Salt Lake, I had decided that I'd had enough. I'd been racing for 30...

BEN WATERWORTH: What was it?

ZALI STEGGALL: I was 27, so 13 years internationally. 13 years, so 26 winters in a row. I'd never had a summer. I'd never been injured, so I'd never missed a year. I started racing when I was five and pretty much raced my entire life from then. And then from the age of 14 to 27, raced Australian winters and European winters. So I just... I was tired is the best way I can describe it. I wasn't broken physically. I had no injuries, but mentally, I was tired. I just couldn't quite maintain it anymore. And so by the time I got to felt like I had decided that that was enough. But the hardest part, I think, for athletes is always to know when it is time to call it a day. And usually either injury does it for you or results do it for you. And I think it's always gonna be really hard and bittersweet because you've been... You've so much of your life has been focused on something and all of a sudden, even though you're still really good at it, you've got to decide to shut that off and go and do something else. And so it takes... It's a really tough decision to take. But by the time I got to 2002, I was quite tired. Mentally, I think emotionally, I was just tired. And the best thing that could have happened for me would have probably been to take a year off and then come back and just have a break. But look, in those days, I didn't really think that that was possible. I had two coaches that were employed to support me. And if I'm not racing, well, what happens to them? And there was a lot of responsibility that came with it. So I think it was a combination of a lot of factors that made it kind of difficult. But ironically, in the end, because it was going to be my... And that was my last ever race. I've never done a slalom since. So it's still a bit bittersweet, really, when I think back to it. I had an absolutely sleepless night the night before. I could not go to sleep. So by the time I got to the race in the morning, it was very much a, right, this is your last one. You've got to just enjoy it. You've got to put it on the line. And ironically, I'd been having a horrible well-cut season, and I was actually doing really well in the run. The conditions were atrocious. The snow was rotten. It was that kind of soft, wet snow underneath, and they'd put chemicals on top to try and make it go hard. And it had basically broken through a crust of ice with soft underneath. So it was just horrible conditions. And I had about a mid-20 start number where by the time I went, the ruts were huge and the conditions were just atrocious. But I remember absolutely putting it all on the line. And I think, you know, by the time I fell about five gates from the finish, feeling completely out of control because I was trying so desperately to go fast through these ruts. And ironically, my split times were really good. I was actually really in the hunt compared to everyone else due to the conditions. And so once, you know, you pick yourself up out of the snow, there's a huge sense of disappointment. And for me, it was also that sense of, you know, wow, that's it, that's the shutting of the door. I'm usually a person that stands by my word. So, you know, if I've said that was it, that's my last right, that's it. And so to feel that that was the way I was gonna go out was initially really, really crushing. But then I sort of felt, do you know what? It isn't because I went out giving it everything. You know, I fell because I caught an edge, I flew off to the side. It wasn't, you know, I didn't, there was no quitting, there was no giving up. It was just, you know, bad luck, but putting it all on the line. And that's sort of what ultimately I wanted to do. And yeah, so I felt like it was really, you know, disappointing in that sense. But I think by the time, you know, once the disappointment of the actual race sort of wore off in that that was over, I was emotionally so tired. But yeah, I think, you know, it was time to hang up the skis.

BEN WATERWORTH: Time to hang up the skis. And as you're saying, like no summer, I mean, you're from Manly. I mean, come on, you deserve a summer at least.

ZALI STEGGALL: Yeah, look, it was summers, it was friends, it was, you know, it was just, it was a very isolated lifestyle. And like I said, before the days of Facebook and the internet and mobile phones and, you know, the world is such a more connected place now than what it was then. And so you just didn't have that, you know, the support around you of your friends, you know, like my friends followed me, but from a distance, like everything was sort of hard. So by then I was 27 and I felt like, you know, it was time to move on to a new challenge. I felt like I'd been there, done that, and it's time to find something new to do.

BEN WATERWORTH: And you've definitely done that. I mean, you know, post-retirement, you know, highly prominent barrister there in Sydney, you know, you become a mother, you're married, you're leading a very successful life. I mean, how is Zali Steggall's life 2.0? I guess you've had, you know, skiing, part one, now you've got barrister part two. Is it a different form of adrenaline rush and all that sort of stuff, as opposed to when you were an athlete?

ZALI STEGGALL: Totally. And look, for me, I remember in my press conference in Salt Lake City, I got asked, you know, what was the highlight of my life? And I said, well, look, I really hope I haven't had it yet, because I'm 27 and there's a few years to go. And I really hope there's still a high life, you know. Yes, the opportunity to be, you know, have an Olympic sporting career is fantastic. And I've been really blessed in terms of getting those results, but I certainly hope there's going to be more, you know, that my life has still got, you know, you don't want to feel like that's the highlight. So for me, it was really important to find a new challenge. And I think it is really difficult for athletes to move on from sporting careers. I think so many years of focusing on excellence, on achieving success, it's really hard to walk away, but it's also really hard to find contentment in. And I say less of things without being, you know, pejorative. It's less of things in the sense that you're not going for Olympic gold medals, but every goal that you go for is important to the person that's going for it. So you're not always going to get recognition for everything you're aiming for. And you have to learn to adjust to that, to learn to adjust that the media and, you know, the public is not going to care about every goal you're going for, but it doesn't mean it matters any less to you and your development. So it was really important for me when I retired to find something that was going to be really challenging. So I decided to completely move away from sport and have a career in law. And I started absolutely from the beginning. I was a receptionist. I was a paralegal. There was no glamour in what I was doing. I started from the bottom. There was no special doors opened for me. But I think it's really important to do it that way, because that's the way you had to come up through your sport. So there's no reason why you shouldn't have to come up through your professional career in exactly the same way. And look, I was really keen to have kids, so I was really lucky to have my two boys and then remarried and had a big family with lots of kids. So that's really challenging in itself. I used to say that with kids, it's a gold medal every day. When you get to the end of the day and everything has gone well, it's busy and it's always a challenge. But I think as long as you're challenged, then it's fun. I think it's a minute that there's no challenge that it stops being interesting.

BEN WATERWORTH: I mean, and with those challenges, I mean, this year, too, I believe you've been, you're going to be hearing cases in the court of arbitration of sport, too. I mean, you're the first winter Olympic medallist, I believe, to be on this panel. And it's only sort of a recent role that you've been appointed to. I mean, this is this sounds pretty, pretty big. I mean, how did this come about? How do you feel about this?

ZALI STEGGALL: Look, I've been really lucky. I got involved clearly, you know, the connection of sports and law. And I've done quite a bit over the years with the National Federation Appeals Panel for the Olympic Committee, where athletes have missed out on selection, have a process of appealing, whether it's in sort of the interpretation of the rules or how they've been applied. And I've participated in that as counsel, but also as, I guess, adjudicator in terms of determining those appeals. And I've found it really interesting for me that it combines my, you know, I certainly have understanding and affinity for the athletes because I've been there, but I do look at it also from my legal perspective of understanding the construction and the factors that need to be taken into account. So I've really enjoyed that combining of sort of the various sides of my life in being able to give back to sport in that way. And the Court of Arbitration for sport, the appointment was, you know, it's really, really flashed that I was considered and appointed in that way. And I really look forward to be able to give back to sort of the sport and maybe help athletes through that process. I think as an individual athlete, I was forced to be very hands-on in my process. You know, like I was very involved in my programmes. I was already an athlete representative on the board of the IWIA. I wasn't very involved. I think more so than what most athletes normally are. So I had that, I was lucky to have that experience of sort of both sides. You know, I thought behind the curtain as to how the team worked and how the funding and the programmes and all that. So it was really good to have an opportunity to put all that experience together in terms of helping sports. And I, you know, I'm on a couple of boards as well, which helped me, gives me that opportunity to give back to the sports. And, you know, I've gone back to being on the board of the Olympic Winter Institute, which I really enjoy, because that's again, that planning and helps sort of, you know, giving something back to the next generations and the programmes. And so look, yeah, I've been really lucky in terms of opportunities of, you know, I think I've worked hard. Every day in front of a judge is nerve wracking. It's like standing at the start of a race. You're not quite sure how it's gonna go, and you're gonna do the best you can. You always try to prepare as best you can and hope that you're gonna be able to, you know, think on your feet and do the best possible for your client. And that's at the end of the day. I think that's, you know, what I like about, I guess, my profession is that it is quite stimulating and challenging in that way. But yeah, so we'll see.

BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, definitely. Just before we let you go, Zali, next year, as we said, 20 years, I've just looked at here, it's February the 19th. Are there going to be any plans, perhaps, February 19, 2018, that you might just sit down, have a quiet little drink, put the medal around your neck, maybe put it on the TV and just reflect on it, that it's been now that anniversary of it?

ZALI STEGGALL: Actually, my husband, Tim and I were talking about it, that we're really keen to take the kids to Japan next year, actually, to go back over to Nagano and up to Shigekogen. So, really keen to take them there. I think it's a trip down memory lane for me more than them. But they don't care half as much. But I probably will do that. Just to be totally honest, my husband is the one who's the most proud and he tends to be the most sentimental about milestones and things like that. And he, even though he didn't know me back in those days, he was very, he's always the one who really, you know, is very proud and sort of brings out the, you know, the memories of the past and the accomplishments.

BEN WATERWORTH: That's great. That's great. Well, I'm saying that to all our listeners, whether you're in Australia, Canada, wherever you are, February 19th, 2018, I'm officially declaring International Zali Steggall Day, so everybody can go out there and join in with the celebrations and commemorate such a momentous day in Australian sporting history. Zali, it's been a huge pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us today, and best of luck with everything. And thank you very much for taking us through your career. Today's been a lot of fun.

ZALI STEGGALL: My pleasure.

BEN WATERWORTH: Such a pleasure, not going to keep talking it up because you heard me in the intro, you heard me throughout the interview. I'm still fanboying, just being able to bring this to you. So once again, big thanks to Zali, and perhaps we'll get her on the show, maybe moving forward in the next 12 months when it comes to talking a little bit more about Pyeongchang and getting more of a preview in regards to that. And speaking of previews, we were said in a few of these interviews that we're hoping to get the gang together, Jared and Colin and myself all together to talk about Pyeongchang, to talk about Commonwealth Games, to talk about everything else in between here and Off The Podium. Jared hasn't been on an episode since Rio, and we're looking forward to bringing him back. So that's in the Pipeworks. Stay tuned. We hope to be able to bring you that very, very soon. And as I kind of mentioned in our Catherine Skinner interview as well, stay tuned for some classic interviews that have been done over the years, sort of as I mentioned, through my former radio ventures. I've interviewed several Olympic athletes, and we're gonna bring those interviews to you, kind of like as a opening the vault, so to speak. And while not necessarily current in terms of what they will talk about, it's still fun to be able to revisit these chats that personally I've had with Olympic athletes and that have always ranked up there with some of my favourite interviews throughout my career. So stay tuned for those. Stay tuned to our Facebook page, Off The Podium Podcast. It's where you go, like us on there, and you can stay up to date with everything. Send us a message on there. We'd always, of course, love to hear from you. And iTunes is the way to go to get these podcasts. Remember to rate and subscribe as well as leave us feedback. We always like to see what you think. And other podcasting services coming soon. We'll stay up to date with those as we keep going on. Colin, too, has some interviews that he's got underway, and they will be coming your way to your speakers very, very soon for that added Canadian perspective. It's great to kind of get two sides as we really give you a multi-international podcast on the Olympics, which is what the Olympics are about. International, bringing the world together. We're doing that for a podcast. So you're welcome, Podcasting World. We're out of here. My name's Ben. Thanks for tuning in, and thanks once again to Zali, and we'll speak to you next time, here on Off The Podium.