Hannah Campbell-Pegg Interview
We’re excited to bring you a great interview today as for the first time we get to learn a little bit more about the sport of luge by talking with two-time Olympian Hannah Campbell-Pegg. Hannah talks us through her journey in getting into the sport, from starting off as a bobsleigh athlete to what brought about the transition into luge. She also takes us through her two Olympic experiences, detailing what it is like for an athlete from a country with no luge history to compete on the world stage as well as going over the experience in Vancouver after the tragic death of her friend Nodar Kumaritashvili. We also learn more about what is in store for the sport in Australia moving forward, and just why her parents weren’t exactly too happy with her after her first time competing in the sport. It’s one great and informative interview that you won’t want to miss!
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Please note this is an automated transcript that may contain errors.
BEN WATERWORTH: It is Off The Podium, An Olympics Podcast coming to you today for an interview. That is right, we teased a lot of these during the Tokyo Olympic coverage that we had a few interviews banked and ready to go. And we are here today to bring you the very first one of those. We are chatting, of course, with our first ever competitor from the sport of luge, Hannah Campbell-Pegg, a two-time Olympian competed in 2006 and 2010 for Australia. And this is a unique chat, a very interesting chat, learning about just how Hannah got involved in the sport of luge. I guess how her time competing at the Olympics led her on to some more bigger and better things in the sport of luge in this country, and just what it takes to get people involved in luge in Australia. A fascinating and fun, insightful chat here that I know you are going to enjoy. So without further ado, sit back, relax, and listen to our chat with Olympic luge athlete Hannah Campbell-Pegg.
BEN WATERWORTH: Very excited to have our next guest here on Off The Podium as we continue to tick off the sports in some way. We're wanting to speak to athletes from all the different Olympic sports. And I'm very excited for today's guest. She is from the sport of luge. Now, I love the luge. I love watching anything to do with the sliding sports, be it bobsled, skeleton and luge. And luge is definitely one of these ones that has fascinated me. If anyone listened to our coverage during Pyeongchang, you would remember our fondness for the luge, particular certain variants of luge, which maybe we can talk about in this interview. But our guest today competed in two Olympics, the first Australian to ever compete in two Olympics in the sport of luge, in 2006 in Turin and 2010 in Vancouver. She also currently serves as the president of Luge Australia and is helping out right now with our current luge athlete, who is aiming to compete in his third Olympics, Alex Ferlazzo, and we'll talk about him, of course, in this interview. But right now, we're not talking about him, we're talking about Hannah Campbell-Pegg, and she's with me right now. Hannah, welcome to Off The Podium.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Thanks for having me.
BEN WATERWORTH: It's a massive pleasure, because as I said, luge is just one of these sports that I am fascinated by. It's so fun to watch. It's never boring. It's always exciting. And you're the first person, as I said, from luge on here. I think the first person in my life that I can ever say that I've talked to who has done luge. So I'm sure you've been asked all the questions beforehand, but first of all, I'm going to start flat out the obvious question. Like, what the hell is wrong with you? Why do you want to strap on a sled and go down that fast? I mean, it's a crazy sport. It's amazing, but I don't think I'd ever want to do it. Why did you want to do it?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think I needed a challenge. I took, I did like pretty much everything when I was a kid. I played a lot of tennis, water polo, swimming, surfing, like every Australian does, yeah, and took everything to a certain level. And I think got to be bored, to be honest. And then somebody said to me, why don't you try out for the Women's Bob Saitame? And tried out for that, did it for a couple of years, and then decided to switch over to Luge after two years in 2004. I think it was, yes, 2004. And then, yeah, I kept going from there, because it was just such a challenge, because it was so different from anything I've ever done before, and it was so exciting at the same time.
BEN WATERWORTH: I was going to say, tennis, water polo, they don't exactly... It's not like you were doing sprinting or something like that. It's kind of a little bit different. Was it also a case of something like the Olympics? Had the Olympics always been a goal of yours? Is that why you were doing things like tennis and water polo to maybe aim for an Olympics, and then the bobsled switch came because you were thinking, well, I'd love to go to an Olympics, I'm going to try different Olympic sports?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think when you always take a sport, especially when you're training for it, you always picture yourself at the highest level anyway. So I think when I was a kid and I was playing tennis, I'd always picture myself being at the Australian Open or something. And when I was doing water polo, I was a bit later when I got into water polo as well. So I think I was a bit more realistic about my expectations where I could go with that. I was just happy playing at university level and so on. So, and at university level, we did play with quite a few people on the state and national teams, but I'd say the skill difference between us. So I was a bit more realistic, I think, in that area. But definitely when you're at school, I think you're always looking and thinking, oh, I could be at the Olympics and I could do this. And I think most kids who play sport have that dream to be at the Olympics because it is the pinnacle of a sporting performance.
BEN WATERWORTH: What is that process like then when you say you want to try out for the women's bobsleigh team? Because I can't imagine you just rock up to your local bobsled track. You kind of can't do that in Australia. So I mean, how do you go about trying out for the Australian bobsled team?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, I think it was just, look, they had a dry track down in Docklands, in Melbourne at the time. And me and another girl went down. I think, no, the first time I went down. And we went down, and look, they took everybody, because there were, I think, so few of us who were interested. So it wasn't really any mean feat in trying out for it. And then we went overseas and did what was called a bobsleigh school. And did that, and you had to pass your driving and get your little driver's licence for driving a bobsled.
BEN WATERWORTH: Do you have L plates on the sled?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I remember two runs down the track and I crashed both of them. So that wasn't too brilliant. But then I got back in and kind of got a little bit more oriented on the track and loved it. And that was it. But it was, you know, and then the training started really, I suppose. Because I suppose with these sports, because you don't have access to them, you really do have to go over and you can get some of the best sprinters and the best athletes in the world. They might not be able to transfer those skills onto running on ice or so on, or they actually just might be extremely scared about going down a bobsleigh track. Because I remember the first time I looked at one and I thought it was going to be totally different than it was. These corners were, you know, taller than a house on some of them, like taller than a two-storey house. And these athletes and these sleds were in the middle of them, or, you know, if they're doing a bad line, they were up the top or down the bottom. But the, yeah, it was kind of, yeah, it was a little bit overwhelming at first, and especially the first couple of runs. So I think with a lot of these athletes, you kind of have to get over there and these tougher sports and try it, because we've got no facilities here in Australia in order to be able to do that. You've got to take that chance. And that's what I did when it was season. Gave it a go, and then, yeah. And then I just kept going.
BEN WATERWORTH: Because it's also with any of the sliding sports, be it bobsleigh, luge and skeleton, I mean, isn't there only something like about 20 or something courses in the world? Because obviously, generally, you will only have a sliding course for an Olympic city or some World Cup city. So there's actually not even just outside of an Australia thing, right? There's limited facilities in the world in general.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Very limited. So I just actually did my thesis on this. On tracks in the world. So I should really know, but 15 operations, 17 operational.
BEN WATERWORTH: Wow, it's less than 20.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, actually 15 operational because five had shut down. But they've all got plans to try and get reinstated and operate. So it's, yeah, it's, there aren't many, and there's not one in the southern hemisphere either. So, which is really tricky for people from New Zealand, or there's the natural track in New Zealand, but it's just a training track, and it's not that similar to artificial luge. So yeah, so there's nothing for Australians and Kiwis and anybody from Tonga, as we had a slider from Tonga before, to train at. That's close. So the closest tracks for us are Asia. So you've always got to travel. You've always got to be somewhere else. And the logistics and the expense involved in those logistics as well is, yeah, challenging at times.
BEN WATERWORTH: Because it's always fascinating when you sort of hear a lot of stories about Australian Winter Olympians, particularly say with the success we've had in things like aerials and things like that, where you see the facilities. They've just built that one in Queensland now. And obviously it's like the water training. So you can kind of, I guess, makeshift something to a level for those sports. But I guess you can't just build some giant track that's in the middle of the suburbs of Sydney or something like that to kind of replicate what you were achieving in a sport like bobsleigh, lose your skeleton, can you?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No, and at a cost of over a hundred million dollars, like US dollars as well, it's just not sustainable either. And they cost a lot to maintain each year as well. So it's not something that you could just go and build because you've got to have the right climate, but also the right location for everybody to come and use the track to make sure that it is utilised properly too. So yeah, and that's why you've only got them in these winter Olympic regions or these winter regions, because otherwise you probably wouldn't have anywhere near as many lose your bobsleigh tracks in the world if there hadn't been the Olympics, if it wasn't involved in the Olympics.
BEN WATERWORTH: I'm just thinking back to the Roy and HG Smiggins-Holes bid for 2010. I don't know how long that track would have lasted. The legacy might have been a bit of a white elephant after those games. You talked about seeing the track for the first time, kind of not, that wasn't exactly what you were expecting. Do you remember your first run in a bobsled down one of those tracks and that feeling? Because I can imagine that that is a pretty insane feeling, getting up to those speeds and going down a track like that, particularly, first of all, on a bobsled, and eventually, when you went down on a luge.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, my very first run, I remember just feeling totally out of control and not knowing which corner I was in, what part of the track. I was so disoriented. I didn't know how I was steering this thing properly. Yeah, and that eventually ended me crashing. So, but you know, you learn things from every mistake.
BEN WATERWORTH: Did you want to quit after that? Were you like, no, this isn't for me? Or were you thinking like, that was fun, I'm doing that again?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Then, you know, cause we're 12, we had to do two runs. So I'm the type of person who even if I'm quite scared of something, I'll still get back in and I'll still do it. And I did, and I crashed again. I went home that night and I was just like, I don't know what I'm doing. Why am I doing this? Why am I here? But then the coach said, all right, we're gonna go through this again and get you down. And we did, and then it was totally fine after that. I enjoyed it and actually it registered what I was meant to do and got used to it. So it was, yeah, it was just all really overwhelming because of these camps as well. You had so many people. There's like, illusion is different. You've got one side, one person. Whereas in Bobso, you've got two, one side, two people. So there were so many people there learning how to drive and from different countries. It was all so overwhelming. And yeah, so foreign as well.
BEN WATERWORTH: Was there a pathway from what you were doing in Bobso, like to the Olympics, like was that obviously the goal, but like was, were you on track? Kind of like, what was the initial moment when you were like, okay, no, I'm switching to lose. This maybe isn't working out what I thought it would work out like.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Oh, for me, Bobso, it just got too political. And I just wasn't enjoying it anymore. It became, yeah, just not nice to be involved in. And I thought, you know what? Yeah, I'd prefer to do, I still love sliding. I still want the challenge because it was after two years that I'd done it. And I'd also suffered quite a few injuries. I had stress fractures in my legs. And I was like, okay, I'm over this. And yeah, and so I just ended up saying, okay, right. I still love sliding, what can I do? And it was pretty much process of elimination because bobsleigh and skeleton were tied together in the same federation. So luge was the sport that wasn't. I went, okay, well, I'll give that a go. And I gave it a go. And yeah, the next few went over and did a luge camp and had a great time. And it was brilliant. Like, you know, there was, I think I crashed once in that whole week, the first week. And a great little group of people that we did it with. And then we had what was called Small Nations team. So you had a collection of athletes from Slovenia, from Slovakia, from Argentina, Venezuela, Bulgaria. And so we formed this awesome little family. And I think that's what was missing in Bobsleigh as well, because it was that family. And even now, to this day, we're still all together. And it's, I suppose, yeah, all of them that made the experience so much better and the encouragement from everybody that just kept you going. You loved it so much more. But even just that feeling of me by myself and me being in control was a lot better, I think, as well, than Bobsleigh.
BEN WATERWORTH: I have to ask the obvious question. Why are all three not under the same umbrella? Why are Bobsleigh and Skeleton together, but Louge is separate if you're all sliding sports?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Exactly. So two separate international federations as well. They used to all be under the same umbrella, years and years and years ago. And then they had a split, purely because I think they have different start heights as well. So I mean, it makes sense for Bobsleigh and Skeleton to run off the same start height because they both run and sprint at the beginning of theirs, and they use the same start, whereas Louge actually needs a ramp. So, yeah, so that's, and they just operate on different circuits as well. So it's, yeah, I think there was probably some political reason for it way back.
BEN WATERWORTH: So there's a rivalry then, I'm guessing. So like the losers and then you're not all sitting together at like the table for the post-Olympics function or something like that.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I know, like the Australians, we all get along really well. Yeah, but we don't see each other on circuit ever, which is a real shame. Whereas the skeleton and the bobsleigh usually all travel together. Whereas luge, we don't, which is a bit sad. Whereas we sometimes are only like, oh, okay, I'm here for two days and we cross paths. And when one person was training or something, and we'd catch up, but yeah, we'd never compete at the same places, which was a bit sad. But no, we still all get along, still a lot of us from back in the day, still good mates.
BEN WATERWORTH: That's good to know. I'm glad that there isn't just this intra-rivalry where all the sledding sports and that are kind of secretly throwing snowballs at each other or something afterwards.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Potentially, and internationally, they get along as well because they need to in order to coordinate things like safety for tracks and the facilities as well. So and their programs each year and who's got what track at what time. So I do think they all do get along. You know, Luge, because Luge brings athletes. They start in Germany. They start from five years old at times. So Luge kind of you have a very young sort of athlete contingent, and then athletes are usually done in their 20s. Some of the older ones used to last. I mean, there was one guy who was still going in their 40s, which is very rare. But you could still then switch your career as a Luge athlete into being a bobsleigh driver because they're more 20, like late 20s into their 30s. And you'd probably be one of the best bobsleigh drivers if you've been driving a Luge for so many years because you know all the tracks and you know all the feeling and the driving points and steering points.
BEN WATERWORTH: With those tracks in the world, obviously, as you said, Luge, you start on the ramp where Skeleton and bobsleigh are doing the running start. Do each of those tracks cater for Luge as well as bobsleigh? I mean, is there like one track in the world that maybe doesn't have the Luge ramp that you can never go to?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, there's a couple of those. So the original Cortina is too dangerous for a Luge, is what they always said. I never went there, close in 2008. I think it was only being used for Skeleton and bobsleigh at that stage. But Oberhof in Germany, it could only be used maybe for Monobob now, which is like the single bob, but mainly it's known as a Luge track. And that's basically because there isn't the ramps as well. And I don't, yeah, and just sometimes the way that the curves go too, I think. But I just know that it's not something that bobsleigh's really trained on. But I mean, Germany's got three other tracks, so.
BEN WATERWORTH: Well, you mentioned about it not being safe for Luge. I mean, I guess on that question, like, is there a key besides the ramp and besides the starting point for the bobsled skeleton? Like, does a Luge take the course differently to a skeleton, for example? I mean, two very similar, I guess. As a non-athlete, I'm going to say, well, the only difference is you go down forward and go down backwards. I'm sure there's a lot of differences between the two. But like, is there much of a difference to how a Luge is going to take a track versus a skeleton? And then a bobsled as well?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Just in the lines, I'd say, as well. I mean, I've taken, I think, two runs down on a skeleton once before. But, I mean, the big difference, though, as well, I suppose, between a bobsled and going down a Luge too, is like, you know, if the bobsled hits the wall, the bobsled hits the wall. Whereas if you hit a wall, you hit the wall. But, yeah, you do, look, the driving is very different. So in Luge, you're doing something all the time with your steering wise. And you've got six steering points on a sled in Luge. Whereas in a bobsled, you've got two, which is your D-rings, which is your handles. So, you know, there is some difference in the lines and the steering points would be different, but it's been, oh gosh, 20 years since I drove a bobsled. So I'm probably quite out of the picture of being able to comment on that. But yeah, there was, it was definitely different and went between the two when I was driving them.
BEN WATERWORTH: When you get on a luge for the first time, so you mentioned there, two steering points for a bobsled, six for a luge. I mean, are you surprised? Like I'm surprised to hear that there are six steering points for a luge. I mean, how does that go through your head? And what, tell me, where are the six steering points? Where are you steering from?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So you steer with both your shoulders by laying your shoulders into the pod. You've got, you're holding onto handles as well underneath your sort of backside and then your feet as well, both your feet. So, and you're steering kind of changes with each way, like with the, every time you get onto a curve or something, you can, you generally push a shoulder in, like pull a handle and then push your opposite foot down as well in order to steer through.
BEN WATERWORTH: Sounds very complicated. Like, I mean, God, I can barely steer a car with two hands and you're doing this with like, you know, every part of your body, like, wow.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: And it really depends on the corner as well. So a lot of people don't understand that you, you actually, like people think that you just like, like Bowie and HG said, you know, you just lie back and do nothing.
BEN WATERWORTH: I'm going to say right now, Hannah, we were guilty of saying that during Pyeongchang. I'm apologising right now for our comments. Don't go back and listen to those. We were like, ah, luge is easy. You just push off and you lay there. What else do you do?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, my do nothing approach resulted in me ending up in a hospital with a broken back. So that was in my early days. But basically, every corner is different. And before every, we go to a track, we go the day before or the morning before we get there, and before we do our runs and we have to go through and do a track walk. Where you go from the bottom up to the top, going through the last corner and building on. So the track's got 14 curves you go through and you'd be like, okay, you exit at this point and steering off this corner. And then you go to the beginning of the corner and you go, all right. So it's a middle entry and then you get on the wall, you steer with it and it will be different steering points for each one. Sometimes I'll be like, just a shoulder steer on this or they'll be like, okay, this is where you really steer it with your shoulder, your handles and your foot like. So it's quite, yeah, there's quite a science to it.
BEN WATERWORTH: Wow, wow, that's fascinating.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: And that's just one curve. And then in the middle of the curve, you have to hold it there on the wall so that you don't lose and so that any pressure. So it's, and it's, yeah, it really is a science. So I remember one coach saying to me, if you want to get really good at this, go and study physics. I was like, I'd like to get really good at this, but.
BEN WATERWORTH: I don't want to study physics. I'm the one that told me all this. Because I find that like, fascinating. I'm a big Formula One fan. So, you know, kind of the, there's ways and means of entering and exiting a corner, obviously in Formula One and kind of studying that and everything along those lines. But I can imagine in that aspect, what you're saying about how a certain corner is a certain part of the body that you're steering in that. Like, does that then, just say like the best losers in the world, do they have a style where maybe you've got the ones who are so good with their shoulders versus some who are really good with their legs? Like, does that make a difference or is it such an all-around sort of thing that you can't really have, say, somebody who is renowned as the shoulder steerer versus the leg steerer?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No, it's also I always remember watching one of the top guys who was one nearly every, so he was Armand Zergler and he was from Italy and he won the gold in Turin and he's amazing. He was great. I always remember watching him and everybody sort of held their breath as he went into one corner and you have these shades that go down so that the sun doesn't hit the shades and hit the ice and melt it. And it came out the shades perfectly. And I think as well, and somebody said to me, you see, that's a true athlete. You can never not, sometimes you're always going to get into trouble in these sports, but it's your ability to fix that problem as well and steer yourself out of trouble. And he was extremely good at that, but it comes down to experience too. One coach always used to say to me, you've got to get your ice metres up and it is just runs down the track and it's just practice. And we've had that many people who sit there and they're like, oh, you know, but they'll be able to make the Olympics next year. And I'm like, no, you won't be able to make the Olympics next year. You need to do a lot of training. Like, you're not safe. Like you shouldn't push yourself. Like if anything for me to win, I probably, you know, I was very lucky to make. I qualified 30 out of 30 in an Olympic Adjusted field, but I'd only been sliding 19 weeks by the time I actually qualified for those Olympics. By the time that I got to the Games, I'd only had 26 weeks on ice all up. And those as well, they weren't, you know, a training week you can get 20 plus runs. Whereas a competition week, you're lucky if you got like nine or 10, depending on which, you know, you have a qualification round you in. So usually around 10. But you, there's not a lot of time on the ice. And that's, I think, where the problems come in. There's the inexperience. So then, but that's what happens when you're from a country like Australia, where you don't have track that you can go down. That's why you got to spend your time living overseas. Like Alex is going to be leaving in a couple of weeks to go over to America, just purely so he can get on the ice and start training.
BEN WATERWORTH: And is it like a go to, is America the go to place for Australian luge? Is that where you base it? Because it's the best, easiest way to sort of, you know, good relationship with the Americans. Where was your sort of go to track that you spent most of your time training when you could?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So what we used to do, so the International Federation set up a small nations team for when you kind of begin, but you kind of grow out of this team because a lot of beginners come along and as you progress, like it's natural progression, like you see athletes anyway changing coaches in order to, this coach has taken me so far, so I've got to move on to the next one. And they used to organise things called partnerships, and so I had a pattern shaft with the Latvian team. I had one with the Canadian team for a few years, and I did that over a year before the Vancouver games. And that was good. And so you actually immerse yourself in the Canadian team and travel around with them. And then after the Olympics, I ended up having a partnership with the Latvian team, which was fantastic, because it gave me some other training on another track and a different style of coaching as well. And then Alex has a partnership with America, which has been a great experience as well, I think as well, travelling with Latvia was fantastic, but there is also that language divide. So I would try and learn some Russian to be able to communicate with the Latvian coaches and some Latvian. And yeah, so there was always, and Alex had a partnership with them as well.
BEN WATERWORTH: And are they accommodating in that? Like, are they very happy to kind of help accommodate sort of these smaller nations to help them out?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, they are. And that's what's so great about, like it's a small sport internationally, if you think about it, like with the population that competes in the sport. And the nations, it is one big family. And that's, you know, it's so rewarding to be a part of it as well. And you've got, so each, the International Federation will pay the, not a huge sum either, but they will pay them a partnership sort of fee, I suppose, to take on one of the people from the smaller nations to help the development. So the International Federation is very into assisting smaller nations in order to develop the sport. So it's really nice. Yeah, it's actually, it's a really nice involvement and it's a great way of doing it. So the Swedish used to have a partnership with the Americans and the Koreans with Russia. And yeah, throughout the years, I think the French used to have one with Russia years ago when I did it, and the Japanese with the Italians. So it was-
BEN WATERWORTH: I'm noticing you're not saying the Germans, clearly because they win everything. They just don't want to share this success, right? The Germans are just, nah, screw it, we're not helping anyone.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: To be really fair to the Germans, actually, they do take a lot of partnerships. They took Poland for a while. I think they do have someone that travels with them. But because I've been, I'm not travelling on circuit any longer. I wouldn't know who it is, but when I was travelling, they took the Polish team, and the Polish, and I think they had the Croatians.
BEN WATERWORTH: Right, okay. Well, good to see that. I mean, haven't they won, like, isn't it? I'm looking here, at least in the women's, they haven't lost the gold since 1994. So, and then in the men's, sort of a little bit more spread out. But yeah, the Germans are a little bit dominant in luge. I can imagine that going to compete in Germany is a little bit different to competing somewhere else, because I'm guessing it's almost like just a primetime television sport, and they had rock stars over there in Germany, the German lugeists.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, no, you go into one town in Cunixay, and they have a sign saying, this athlete lives here as you drive into the town. So, yeah, I think they're, and they all drive around in their sponsored cars, and then they're-
BEN WATERWORTH: BMWs and Mercedes and things like that.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think really old bands and things like that.
BEN WATERWORTH: Do you remember, you mentioned about your first time in a bobsled, do you remember your first time on a luge? I mean, how can, besides the obvious differences between a sled, a bobsled and a luge sled, like, I mean, was there like a key difference in that feeling when you're going down on your back versus sort of, you know, almost a sled like a bobsled?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I remember getting off because as well, you start, you don't just go, so there's 14 corners on a track. You just don't throw yourself off from a corner one. You actually start, I remember the first time we started, we started from corner nine. So we only had four corners to go through. And I remember getting off and being like, that was actually really easy. But then you keep moving up and then we'd move up to corner five and then we'd move up to corner one. So after you've done many runs down as well. And that's why I think a lot of athletes start when they're early as well. They do the junior circuit, which will just go from corner five for a very certain amount of time. And then they won't get up until they're doing seniors. But yeah, I do remember it was, it was a nice feeling. I remember thinking that and going, this is actually good. But I kind of wish I'd started on Calgary, which was a, what we call a gliding track, rather than a sliding track. The sliding one's where you really got to steer. Gliding is where you can kind of lay back and, you know, steer, but it's not-
BEN WATERWORTH: Raw NHG it basically, just lay there and do nothing.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It's just, it's not, it's hard to be fast on some of these tracks, because you've got to make sure you've got great aerodynamic position and you make as little mistakes as possible. Excuse me, coughing. But he, yeah, this, this track, I wish I'd started on a more technical track. So I didn't have such a wrong opinion of the sport, because when I got to one of the technical tracks, like I had a great first week. And then my second week, I went to another track called Altenburg, which is one of the most challenging tracks in the world in Germany. And out of 11 runs on that track, I crashed seven.
BEN WATERWORTH: Ouch, wow. And a crash in Luge is a little bit different to a bobsled, because you kind of, as you were saying before, don't really have a lot of shielding around you. So I can imagine that first time coming off a Luge is a bit of a shock to the system.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, I think it is, but then it's actually like sliding on the ice. If the ice has done well, like in Altenburg, they've got what they call an ice master and ice champion. And he's brilliant. He makes really beautiful, soft ice. So crashing there is not too bad. On other tracks.
BEN WATERWORTH: What's the worst? What's the worst you don't want to crash at?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Oh, couldn't. But it's not because of the ice. I like Winterberg. I hate crashing at Winterberg because you couldn't make it up the outrun. You get stuck in it. Actually, most tracks you don't want to crash at. As well, I had this German coach who used to say, if you crash, you have to walk up. So you'd have to put a 23-kilo sled over your shoulder and wet everything, just walk up. And you were looking at probably about 800 metres uphill. Sometimes, but yeah, it wasn't great.
BEN WATERWORTH: This is not the glory of cool runnings when they're carrying the sled across the line and everyone's cheering from them. This is like pick yourself up and kind of tail between your legs.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It's a character building.
BEN WATERWORTH: I like that. I like that outlook of it. I can imagine it's interesting then from the training perspective that obviously with bobsled is sort of mentioning it's the sprint off the start of the line. Like, you know, we talked to Brandon Walker. She was mentioning about the importance of that and kind of what that leads into it. But for Luge, you're sitting, you're from a sitting position and you're using your hands to build that up. So is that the key difference in training that you're working more on your upper body whereas maybe you were working more sort of on the lower body for? Is there a similar training regime that when you switch sports, there wasn't much of a change?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: There wasn't. I mean, look, with Bob say there was a lot of focus on weights, a lot of like, you know, heavy lifting and sprints training. But, I mean, we didn't do a lot of sprints training, but I know quite a few athletes did just purely for speed and I do blocks of that. But basically it was about power and you didn't really train. I did train the upper body, but not specifically because you train. I did do a lot of strength lifting as well. But I suppose the difference with my training was I wasn't doing the sprint training. That was probably in the strength training, probably quite similar. But yeah, it was trying to think back. Yeah, we were doing all the same in the gym. It was the deadlifts, the power cleans, the cleaner jerks, all of those things. But as I got more injured, I was doing less of those things. But yeah, basically it's all about power. And at the beginning of a loose start as well, it's an explosive start. And that's the same with Bob Say. And yeah, you had to practise specifically for doing your paddles, we call them at the beginning. And you wear these tiny little finger spikes that are strapped to your gloves and help you grip onto the ice like a pair of spikes in athletics would do for when you're running on tartan.
BEN WATERWORTH: And is there then a process where, say, maybe you just spend a day practising that start and do you kind of almost have like a training track where you can just literally practising that start? So, you know, obviously, like with the bobsled, you're doing that sort of push start practice. So with you, you're kind of doing that. Is there like positions you can do that? Or is that something you can even do in Australia? Like, is there sort of a temporary setup you can do to just at least practise the start?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, so we had some start handles welded, and we put them together. Firstly, when we first started training, we had them out in an ice rink. And we put them out there, and I was training with an ice rink with the actual sled on ice. Whereas then when I was at the Institute of Sport, we had a wheeled sled, and we'd just put weights all on these, all on the start handles, which would pretty much take all the weights of the gym. So no one else could really be like, is anybody else really lifting that heavy? So I'd take all the weights, and I'd practise on a wheeled sled, doing my starts as well, with my coach at the Institute on their little, had like a 30-metre tartan track in the middle of the gym.
BEN WATERWORTH: You were the first Australian luge Olympian since 1994, Roger White and obviously Diane Ogle in 1992. At that point when you had switched to luge, were there any other Australian athletes attempting? Like were you literally the only one? Had there been other Australians that had been competing on the luge team, but just hadn't made it to an Olympics? Give us an idea of the luge scene when you switched over to luge at that point.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: There was another guy who was doing it at the beginning. When I started as well, he started too, but he was a lot older when he started, and it's sadly not a sport for the old.
BEN WATERWORTH: Damn it, I don't have a chance, Hannah. What are you telling me? Can't start tomorrow.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: We get a lot of it. I started, and in the hindsight as well, I started when I was 22, and it was too late. Everybody else had started when they were 15, 16, and Alex started at 15. But me starting, I had a bit of an idea because I've done bobsleigh, but it's one of those things. It's like surfing, it takes years to get good at. And that's something you can't really just pick up. And when you're younger, you have a lot more feeling. But also my coach, one of my coaches always used to say, no, I don't want anybody over the age of 22 or 24, I think it was, because they don't listen. That's what he used to say, and I was like, okay. But yeah, so he, but yeah, this other guy started, but he, yeah, it's a sport that you've got to, but even if, I mean, we had younger ones as well start after me and they didn't have the feeling as well, honestly. And so it's, I think it's an individual thing as well. It's not so much about the age. You could be great at all those things and you could have the feeling honestly and be relaxed. But I think, you know, as you get older, you get a bit more fearful of a lot more things as well. And you're a lot more aware, whereas when you're younger, it's like, oh yeah, what's going to happen to me?
BEN WATERWORTH: What? So what's that then like then in terms of the support? Like, do you then go to the Australian Olympic Committee and be like, hey, I want to compete in luge. Was there a luge federation when you did that in Australia? Like, did that still exist even though they say weren't any athletes? Or were you still under the banner of bobsled and skeleton back then?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No, so the luge federation was defunct. We had to re-establish it, and I re-established it with a guy called Ted Polglaze, who was a 98 Olympian for bobsled. And so we re-established the federation, and then that enabled me to go over and this other guy as well to go over and compete.
BEN WATERWORTH: That's so unique, though, to think that, like, you literally have to re-instate a federation to compete. Like, this is, I mean, not like, you know, if you're a sprinter or a swimmer, you don't have to do this. Like, it's just, that is such a unique situation to think that you have to, in order to compete on the world stage, re-instate the federation in your country.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, and look, it was an interesting process, too, which I'm really glad now I went through, like, from the beginning stage, because I got to know a lot of people who were involved with it in the past. And, you know, find out a lot about how you could do it. And Diane Ogle, back when she began, she had to set up the whole federation as well herself in order to compete, too. It was quite, it was quite, so her and I were quite similar in that respect. So, yeah, and I'm just thankful for athletes now coming along, like for Alex, he's never had to do that in order to compete in the sport. And that's what I like to prevent for other athletes, because it was a journey, that's for sure. But where there's a will, there's a way, that's definite. And it's been a continuous journey, because as we all know, there's a lot of governance involved in running a national federation, too. But I probably wouldn't have understood as many things going on as an athlete if I hadn't had that experience of doing all of those things. However, at the same time, I kind of wish I could have just been an athlete and not had to have done all those things.
BEN WATERWORTH: Which, when you eventually get to your first international event and you've gone through all that situation, does that bring a sense of pride? I mean, obviously the pride of representing your country, of course, but you've gone through a little bit more than the Germans have, and sort of these people, that again, you've reinstated a federation. So, I mean, I can imagine that that brings with itself a sense of pride when you eventually put the green and gold on and you line up for your first international competition.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think my first international competition, that was the one where I laid back and did nothing, and ended up in an ambulance, waking up strapped to a spinal cord.
BEN WATERWORTH: Wow, good start. I'm sure your parents were very happy. Good choice, Hannah. Glad you did that sport.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Nobody called my parents. It was only when I was in the hospital and got the nurse when I'd woken up, I think the next day, to call my parents. And she was like, and I called my mum. Mum was like, what happened? She was a bit sort of horrified that I was in hospital. And then I didn't know what hospital I was in either, so my parents were nice. They were all quite, yeah, distressed. But I didn't know the extent of my injuries as well. So it was kind of all well done because I didn't know the extent of my injuries. So nobody really got unnecessarily too freaked out about it. It was only actually when I came home four months later that we got x-rays on my back and found out that I had full fracture vertebrae.
BEN WATERWORTH: Ouch. Four months later.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: That explains a lot of the problems I've been having.
BEN WATERWORTH: So what year was this? Was this 2004?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: 2004, yeah.
BEN WATERWORTH: So, you know, less than two years away from an Olympics. I mean, at that point, I can imagine the goal is to try and make the Olympics, but was that like the furthest thing from your mind at that moment?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: One year out from qualifying for the Olympics. So, yeah, it was the goal. No, I'd always said to myself, and I'd said this with Ted as well, we'd say, look, Torino is a bonus. If you make Torino, it's an absolute bonus. But really, the goal is 2010. And, yeah, and then as we kind of got closer and closer, I was like, I actually could do this. And I wanted to keep my options open because I had to do five competitions by December 31st. So basically, and I had to learn all these brand new tracks within a week, within 10 runs as well, to be able to compete on them. So it was challenging to make those Olympics really challenging because I'd never seen these tracks or slid down them. And I was still learning to slide and I had to kind of just put everything into it. And I do remember when I finished the competition and they came out with the overall standings list and because every week you could go through, my coach used to go through and cross out who was like, because it's an Olympic adjusted field, is three people from each nation as the maximum. And when you could have four or sometimes five competing, five names, but only four in one World Cup race. So you could scratch the fourth person from Germany or the fourth person from the US or something like that. So my coach used to go through and cross that out every single week after every race. And he'd be like, oh, this week you might make it, this week you might not. And that was interesting. And I remember after the final race in Lake Placid, and he got back in the car and he said, you're in. And I went, okay. And it was before the 31st date. I think it was around the 15th or something. And I was flying to get back to Australia to have my Christmas back in the sun, finally. Yeah. And I kind of, I went by San Francisco to see a friend, and I remember riding a cable car with her and turning to her and being like, dude, I've just qualified for the Olympics. I was like, I just sit in at that moment and I went, wow, I'm going.
BEN WATERWORTH: So this is only two months removed from 2006.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, so this was in December, and then we competed on Valentine's Day, I remember. Wow.
BEN WATERWORTH: So how does that work then in terms of that you've gotten that spot? Does the AOC kind of have like a seat open just in case you qualify? Because given you're the only athlete, I'm sure they're kind of looking like, how does in the AOC, do you have to call the AOC, say, hey guys, I qualified or they already know that you've qualified?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, I don't think they thought I would because I was so new to the sport as well, and they hadn't had anybody in Lush for ages. So I know they thought we'd had the talk, and they were like, oh, okay, you could potentially as part of the shadow team. So I don't think they, yeah, I don't think they thought I could actually end up being part of it. It was a slim chance anyway. So yeah, we had the call, and I move a calling because, but they don't get the official, they actually, the International Federation will send an official letter to the AOC, and to the AOC, which will then say you have one place from your nation. So if there were two of us, two females, they would say, oh, you know, there's one place. They don't actually list a name. That's up to the National Federation to choose who goes. But you know, there was, so they said you've got one place. So I qualified, which was, yeah. And then they were like, wow, you're on the team. So I actually think I was one of the, I was one of the first officially listed for 2006 and 2010 because, yeah, we found out so early, where some people weren't finding out until a couple of weeks before the Olympics.
BEN WATERWORTH: It's fascinating. Cause like, I hate to keep bringing up cool runnings here, but like, I just, I just imagine that scene when, you know, John Candy's going to the head of the Jamaican Federation saying like, we want to Bob's. And he's like, no, we're not going to support it as a Jamaican. I'm just, I'm seeing you going into the AOC and John Coates or something sitting there, and you're just going like, I want to compete in Luge. No, don't be silly. We don't support Luge. And you're going on the streets raising money, and then you get the nod, and you have to do it anyway, cause you know, you've gotten the slot. There's a movie that could be made about this, Hannah.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Actually, funnily enough, John was so supportive. John Coates, when we set it up, because he was, I think he was, he was on the board or he was president of the original Loosh Federation when it was formed by Diane Ogle. So he was on the board or something like that. So he was really supportive of Loosh, which was, which was fantastic. And they, yeah, they actually, the AOC were brilliant. They were really supportive in getting it all set up. But you know, I hadn't had my uniforms or anything done, cause I don't think anyone was expecting it. But yeah, no, it's everything was pulled together at the very last minute. But, and also now since I organise all that for Alex, I realised what a feat that must have been to have got that all done, because it was, yeah, it was challenging for me to do.
BEN WATERWORTH: Cause just the level of everything with it, because, you know, most Olympians we've talked to on this show, you know, are obviously maybe in sports where, you know, Australia or Canada have an established history and all that sort of stuff. And obviously, you know, Australia had had representation in luge, but we've gone over that. But you're also the solitary athlete from a sport at the Olympics. It's not like you've got a team of people or teammates or things like that. You're Australia's only, you know, luge athlete. So there's so many levels to just the amazement of that. And you talk about that moment when you realise you're going to the Olympics. I mean, do you have a little moment, like even if you're just like at home or something like that, where you just like, you just do a little dance, you're like, fuck, I'm going to be an Olympian. Or like, just, I don't know, like is there just some sort of moment outside of when you were on that cable car, where all of this work, all of this effort, you're the solitary luge athlete, you've started a federation, and you are going to an Olympic Games.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think for me, it was more, I actually, I think I freaked out a little bit more because Torino as a track itself for me, wasn't a good track. I don't think for anyone it was a good track. I'd witnessed one of my teammates from the Small Nations team, and he competed for Brazil. I witnessed him have a pretty bad accident where he was lying in a pool of blood. And after having this crash, and he lost his eyesight in one eye. And after the crash, and I saw the ambulance doors fly open as he was being resuscitated. And that sadly stuck with me for a very long time. So I think after I was like, oh, I've made the Olympics. But then I was like, oh, I knew my skill level in this sport, and it wasn't great in 2006, or the end of 2005 at that stage. So I needed to take myself off and do a lot more training. And that was something I tried to do a lot of, but still, yeah, the anxiety, like I remember the first time we went to Tarina and we were doing a track walk, and the first sled I saw go by, crashed and the sled, like half of the sled came apart. And I remember just thinking, oh my gosh. And it was just this nightmare track, which they fixed. But for somebody who didn't have the experience and found this track challenging, and I'd also had my accident. So that's why I witnessed the accident with my mate, because I had had an accident the day before and got taken off in an ambulance to hospital. And as I was in this hospital, lying there in bed, there were about seven of us who'd come in, all in our sliding gear, all getting taken into hospital by ambulance, because we're all having crashes. And then we weren't very, it wasn't right. But for me, with my experience, sort of I think I was freaking out and getting really nervous. But then on the first day of competition, I ended up achieving one of my goals. So I was really, which was to get below, I think I'd never broken the 50 second on the track. So, you know, and I got down safely and yeah. So once I got through it, it was, yeah, calm down. It was once it was over, it was a lot better. Cause in that whole race as well, there were seven crashes. So out of, we ended up having 31 in the competition and only 24 finished. Yes.
BEN WATERWORTH: I'm looking here that, that, I mean, all those that didn't finish. I mean, you beat a Canadian, you beat an Austrian, you beat an American, you beat an Italian, you've beaten some pretty established nations. You can turn around and say, hey, as an Australian luchist, I beat Canada, I beat America, I beat Italy. Like you're beating established nations, Hannah.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, I think one of the shocks of that race was as well, the Italian Anastasia, she was tipped to win cause she had so much, or get a medal at least. And she was second off. And I remember we were all sitting up in the start house and 81 is what they call out when somebody's crashed and they were on some of the tracks. And we just heard this 81, and this was the second sled off for the whole competition. And we were all looking at each other going, no, no, she can't have crashed. And yeah, 81, she was done, she was out.
BEN WATERWORTH: You're never going to cheer for someone to crash. Of course you're not. But if all of a sudden you...
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I've seen them crash.
BEN WATERWORTH: Well, I was hoping you were going to say that. I was trying to be nice, Hannah, because I can imagine if all of a sudden you have this most amazing run and you're in the gold and all of a sudden, like 13, 14, 15 people in front of you, you're like, shit, I'm in with a chante. Like you pull a Bradbury. Like you literally, everyone crashes except for you. You're a gold medallist. At that point, you're going, yes, I'm a gold medallist. Like...
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Badly in luge, that will never happen. You'll never have 16 crashes. But let's face it, like, spectators will watch Luge, Bob, Science, Skeleton, because they want to see the crashes. That's what they're holding out for.
BEN WATERWORTH: If I watch Formula One, I'm not really a fan. I just want to see them crash. Come on. You know, that's the only reason why, with it that way. Did, in that period from when you qualified to the lead up, you know, the uniform and kind of all that lead up, you're talking about sort of feeling that way. But I mean, do you remember that experience of arriving in Italy? Your first time in the village, like opening ceremony, kind of all those little first moments and things that you have. And like, were you taking it in, or were you just so focused in on your competition that kind of that stuff hit you later on?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I think it hit me later on. It was, yeah, I got taken. We had a car ride that was like, I think two and a half hours up to the village. And then, but we had to, once they got picked up from the airport, you had to go and get all your uniform and get fitted out and all of these things and try on all your clothes. And that was exciting. You were like, oh my gosh, I'm getting all of these clothes, all of these little things. So, and Vegemite. And then, and then-
BEN WATERWORTH: They give you that with a uniform, like have, have Vegemite.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Vegemite, every Olympics is great.
BEN WATERWORTH: Wow.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: That's what, it's funny, cause I don't eat it in Australia, but every time I'm in Europe, all I want is Vegemite. And then, what do we do? Went and drove up to the village, got put in, showed my room, which was, and then my flatmate, my roommate didn't turn up. But then the next day, my roommate turned up, and I think I'd met her once before, and it was one of the skeleton athletes, Michelle Steele. And that was like my roommate for the next three weeks. It was like, hey, and her and I have ended up being really good mates ever since, which is brilliant. So, and all those sort of things. But yeah, I think, and a lot of my 2006 Olympics is her and I going out and discovering the village and doing those types of things. But yeah, and my family all came, except for my older sister as well. And I think those types of things it sort of set in after that. But it was all a bit overwhelming at first. I think I just needed that race to be over. Whereas Vancouver, I was far more relaxed.
BEN WATERWORTH: Well, at least with them in the opening ceremony, you got to see Andrea Bocelli, you got to see what's Ferrari doing, you got to see Ricky Martin in the closing ceremony.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I didn't do the opening ceremony.
BEN WATERWORTH: Oh, you didn't do it either. Oh no, why not?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I was racing on day, I had to train the next day after the opening ceremony. And most of us, we just don't do the opening ceremony because the men compete on day one and the women compete on day three. But we're training on day one. So we're training before the actual opening ceremony. So I decided to put my focus into the training. I went to the Vancouver opening ceremony. That was amazing because I decided I was fine. Otherwise I was going to be sitting around all day the next day anyway. May as well sleep it off. So yeah, and then the closing ceremony. I didn't do either closing ceremony actually. I left before then because I got a bit bored of it. I've been away for so many months. I was just like, okay, I'm done. Just get me out of here. Because we compete. I'd compete and finish by day four. So, you know.
BEN WATERWORTH: You're just like, the free McDonald's in the village. You got sick of that. You're just like, I've had enough Big Macs. I want to go home now.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Look, it was great. But I just, I, yeah, I just, because a lot of my teammates that I trained with on circuit, like all my friends from Luge, they all get to come in and only stay for the competition and then they leave. So a lot of them had left. So I was sort of, you know, I went around, I went skiing for a day. I went, you know, doing these other things. But then, yeah, just after a while.
BEN WATERWORTH: I always feel, because I watch Olympics and I particularly say like the summer ones, they'll talk about how like the swimmers are back in the village because they're competing first thing tomorrow. I'm like, I always would feel that if that was me, I'd be like, no, fuck convention. I don't care I'm getting up before. I'm walking out into that opening ceremony behind my country's flag. I'm going to wave a couple of times and I'm going to go to bed. Like this is coming from a non-athlete, Hannah, clearly. I have no idea what training is like. So, but like, that's just me. I would assume that that would be half the experience. So like when you experience that in Vancouver though, where you all of a sudden like, okay, well, I'm glad I've experienced one of these.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I was so glad I did it. It was such a great opening ceremony. And the thrill, like when you walk in that, the door was like into the stadium and it was just flooded with all this amazing atmosphere that was going on. Yeah, that was, I was so glad I did that. And it was really special too, because my parents had got tickets to the opening ceremony. So they were able to see me walk in and do all of that.
BEN WATERWORTH: It's a great stadium there in Vancouver too, like the roof and everything. I'm sure it would have been even been louder based on the atmosphere.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It was actually like, wow, what am I walking into? It was fantastic. Whereas I did the opening ceremony in Pyeongchang and it's a bit like, oh, okay.
BEN WATERWORTH: This is fine.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: But it was, yeah, it was great. I'm glad I got to experience. The only thing I'm annoyed that I didn't get to experience in Torino was Pavarotti. I think he was, he sunk. And that was amazing to see.
BEN WATERWORTH: Come on, Ricky Martin in the closing. I mean, how Italian can you get? I mean, I'm still baffled 15 years later why Ricky Martin was in the closing ceremony.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: He's, I don't know, he's not even Italian, is he?
BEN WATERWORTH: No, he's, what is he? Is he Puerto Rican, I believe? So yeah, I know Avril Lavigne did the Vancouver, sort of the preview thing, but she was, was she in the opening or the closing in Vancouver? She was in one of them.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Tato and Bryan Adams were in the opening.
BEN WATERWORTH: Of course. You got Katie Lang. You missed out on Nickelback though, if you did the closing. How did you not go to the closing, Hannah?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No, look, I just, after six months of being overseas, I don't know why I didn't, I actually left on the day of the opening ceremony. Wow. Why I did, sorry, now I remember, my sister had had my first Denise. So I, if I could leave on that day, I could go and I could see her.
BEN WATERWORTH: Nickelback or niece?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, I didn't know Nickelback was going and doing it, but yeah.
BEN WATERWORTH: Was it Michael Boo? You saw Michael Booblay was in the opening ceremony, I was here in the closing, I think it was the opening, wasn't he? He did Napoli Forever, I believe, in the openings.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: There were multiple reasons, I think, as well, like I was, yeah, I was tired and just wanted to get home to some sun, I think too. And yeah, all the friends I've left with, like, I mean, see those things as well, they're kind of special to spend with your friends, but like I had friends on the bobsleigh team, I probably should have just gone, yeah. But you know, in hindsight, you look back on these things, it was like, why didn't you do that?
BEN WATERWORTH: Which you mentioned about sort of in Turin, how you were aiming to go under 50, you did that in the training, but then in all four of your runs, you went under 50 seconds as well. So I mean, was that the goal, like once you did it once, you were like, okay, well, I can do this now, I'm gonna make sure each of my runs was under 50. And what was that like to achieve that on each of your runs?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I remember the first run I achieved it and I was like, oh, brilliant, but then it just kept getting better and better. But the thing is though, with race, they do race high, so you're always gonna go faster in races and you're always wearing a more aerodynamic race suit and your sled's done up, race, you know, ready for races as well. So your steels are a lot faster, generally, you know. So any of the weather conditions are right, especially if they're holding it at night, you generally tend to go faster. But, you know, when you're a novice in these sports as well, that was a mindset for myself as a beginner, never been under 50. And then when I got it, I was like, okay, this is good. It was, yeah, if anything, it was a little bit of motivation for me.
BEN WATERWORTH: And also, do you set a goal not to come last? Like, I mean, kind of, you said, like, I don't know how that would work, because like, it's a simple thing to say, I guess, but.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, I ended up, so, originally it was meant to have 30 in the Olympics, but then they opened up a space for somebody else, so there was 31. So, yeah, it was, it was, I qualified close to the end anyway, so I knew there was a high potential. Yeah, so it was the aim not to be very last.
BEN WATERWORTH: What was it, is it like, like, so you beat Argentinian Michelle Despain now, like, I mean, is she a rival? Cause you're kind of like close to it. Like, is there one person, you're like, well, I've got to beat the Argentinian Luz, like traditional rivals in Luz, Australia and Argentina. Like you've got to beat the Argentinian.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: My roommate for like that whole season. So we were on the same small nations team. So, yeah, there was certain like, you know, people that you're like, I'm better than this person.
BEN WATERWORTH: Before, I just, I want to quickly ask about Vancouver and we'll talk about what you've been doing after sort of your career. But I just want to quickly, on the starts, when you're doing the, is there like a number of, I guess, pushes that you're meant to do? Like are you trying to sort of get to a point without touching the ice a certain amount of times? Is there a method, depends on the track or?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It depends on the track, totally depends on the track. So some tracks you can do three pedals, some tracks you can do like Winterberg now, since they changed it, you do several more pedals. It really depends on the ramp and the incline of the ramp as well. So, and how many you can do before, you know, that actually make a difference as well. Before you have to get into your sled and settle in time before you hit a corner.
BEN WATERWORTH: And is there times then when you do a start and you sort of you get into position and you're going down the track where you're like, fuck yeah, that was the best start, I'm on for it here. And then it turns like shit, like I fucked up. And then you've got to kind of make it up. Like, do you have that feeling straight away?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, so if you hit a wall and you start ramp, you're usually, you're screwed. You know, that's not going to come back with a good time and you can't make it back. Because, you know, as you know, with everything, start at the top and if you're slow at the top, you're not going to be that fast. You're not going to be fast at the bottom, whereas if you're fast at the top, you're going to be a lot faster at the bottom. So it's, yeah, if you hit at the top, it's never a good thing.
BEN WATERWORTH: You mentioned with the sled being about 23 kilos. I'm assuming it's sort of a case of weight provides speed in a lot of these sports. So like, does it, is there like a weight sort of category? Like if you're a heaviest sledder, that's more of an advantage. If you're a lighter sledder, it's less. And are you allowed to weight things down to kind of keep the discrepancy if you're a bigger person versus a smaller person?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So when I competed, you could wear lead on yourself, but only up to a certain amount of kilos. So I think it was 75. You and your weight could be set with the weight lead on it, on you, which we used to wear in weight vests around like your torso or in shorts or something. You could only wear a maximum of 10 kilos. But for me myself, it was like I was 71 sometimes when I was competing. So I could only wear 4 kilos of lead. And then when I built up far more muscle, I always had a lot of muscle. But then when I went through a lot of training sessions, I actually ended up being like 76 kilos. So I didn't end up wearing any lead. But there was another girl who was 55 kilos, and she could only ever be 65 kilos because she could wear a maximum of 10.
BEN WATERWORTH: So there's not like boxing where you're weighed. So if you're 76 kilos, it's not a case of you're overweight. You can't compete. It's stiff shit. You're just going to compete how you are.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: There was one athlete who was 100 kilos. She just couldn't wear anything. She had to be like she couldn't wear anything else extra on her. And so I had to wear the absolute minimum.
BEN WATERWORTH: And does that help? Like, is it a case of heavier the better or does it not make much of a difference?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It depends how you drive the track. Like, if you're heavy, if you're like there was one Russian who's like over 100 kilos, and his start was a bit slow, but at the bottom of the track, he was flying and he'd win quite a few races because he carried all of that weight and heavy speed, he'd always take people up on the bottom of the track. Whereas, yeah, if you're not good on the start or if you're hitting corners on the way down, it's never going to help you anyway.
BEN WATERWORTH: In terms of the aerodynamic you're talking about, I mean, that's all about positioning. You know, is there certain special suits? Like, is it kind of like swimming when they had those sort of speed suits that were kind of helping? Like, are they always developing technology for better suits in luge?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, yeah, and there's certain materials that they use as well for the suits. Like, I'm probably a little bit out of that now because, you know, there's certain suit manufacturers that you go to on the circuit. But I haven't worn a suit now for, oh, nearly 10 years.
BEN WATERWORTH: Wow. Not coming out of retirement any time soon then to try for Beijing or Quatina or something along those lines. The period between Turin and Vancouver then, so as you said, Turin was a bit of a bonus. You were always aiming for 2010. So that period, was it then just a case of, okay, well, I'm still going to go towards 2010 and sort of did it become an easier sort of thing to qualify for? Were you right on the cusp again? Or sort of like, how was that process between the two games and then qualifying for 2010?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I always knew I'd qualify for 2010 because the qualification wasn't too difficult. And I qualified comfortably for it as well, which was good. And it was once again being in the top 30 in the Olympic Adjusted Field. So for me, by that stage, it wasn't difficult. But I had four more years of training on top of me by then. So it was good, and I'd learn a lot more. And even if I look back on pictures, just my position on the sled and everything, I look at it and go, okay, yeah. You'd actually learn to slide. Yeah, there's always things that you can improve on as well when you slide too. A lot of luge and a lot of bobsleigh and skeleton rely on the technology in your sled as well. So yeah, and you've also got to, it's not just the sled. Like you could, yeah, give me the fastest sled in the world, but you've got to have the knowledge and the coach as well, the coaching down the track, but the people who are going to help you work on your sled, the people who can help you out with those type of things as well.
BEN WATERWORTH: How much work does go on a sled? And like, is it a case of you just adjusting the slide? Like the kind of what, it's not like a pit stop in Formula One. Again, just reference that sport. But I'm sure there's still technical things and mechanical things that you can do to tweak things. Can you?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, so a lot. And once again, having competed in nearly 10 years, but the, you know, we used to, you do sled work, we call it. So every night you're sanding your skis. And you've got different angles you can put on your skis. You can, you know, and to get them, you're sanding like at the beginning of the season, you're sanding up new sets of skis from like using, what I think 220 grit to like 2000 grit, and then diamond pasting them on top of that to make sure that they're like mirrors that you can see. Yeah, there's a lot of work. There's little things that you can do and tweak your sleds here and there, which we always played around with. Yeah, once again, it was like 10 years ago. And it's probably like, you know, been pushed back into the far...
BEN WATERWORTH: Back of the memory, things like that.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I don't ever have to remember all those lovely times in the sled shop.
BEN WATERWORTH: How is it getting a sled on like a Qantas flight? Do you bring it back to Australia or do you just keep it over in Europe and just pick it up when you go back over there?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Oh, I did keep it in Europe a lot because it was too expensive and Australians didn't get it.
BEN WATERWORTH: What is that in your suitcase? Oh, just a luge.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: And then you'd have to take it apart sometimes and put some... Like some people... One guy carried his steals in a gun case because he could take gun parts on a plane, whereas he couldn't take... Like Air Canada had a clause written into theirs which was said you can't take luges because I think they've been sued for damage to a luge once or multiple luges. And so I remember being at the airport and they said, is it a skeleton or a luge? Because we can't take luges, but we can take skeletons. And I was like, oh, it's a skeleton. They were like, oh, okay, no worries. And I was like, wow. So and for me, travelling separately, I used to take my sled on the flights because it was cheap that way. Whereas when you travelled with the bigger teams, you could put it into the other sled boxes and you pay about 3,000 euros in transport costs per year. That's a bobsleigh, that would be far, far more. So we used to have a big truck that used to turn up with all our sleds and sled boxes. But yeah, and that was easier to not have to bother with all the sleds because then you have to hire a car to take your sled as well. But I mean, a bobsleigh, you got to hire a truck.
BEN WATERWORTH: Did you name them? Did you have names for your sleds?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No. Aw. I'm not sure there are athletes who do, but me, I don't remember.
BEN WATERWORTH: I'm just thinking here, you could do all fancy. And it's also not quite like a bobsleigh where you can paint it all up and make it all fancy. I'm sure you can put a sticker on it or something.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Some people used to have great designs on their sleds, but yeah, mine were bits and pieces, here and there, made up of, you know, you get some parts from Canada, some parts from Latvia, some parts from...
BEN WATERWORTH: Bits and pieces here and there. You finished 23rd in Vancouver. This time around, though, more people finished. So while I guess you could say you were second last in 2006, you were 23rd out of 27 finishes. I mean, same position, but you beat more people. So I mean, like, in all seriousness, like, what were your goals for Vancouver? Like, was it a time thing where you were looking because you'd finished top 20 in the World Cup a year prior? So were you looking for top 20? Kind of what were your goals?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I was looking for a lot better because I had a lot of experience on the track. But we've got to remember that two days, three days before that race, one of the athletes from Georgia died. So we had to, the men got moved to the women's start and the women got moved to the junior start. So we had two runs from the junior start, and then we were competing the next day. So it was a totally different track. It was a totally different speed. So it probably would have been more crashes or something, or, you know, who knows? I could have been one of them. But I think I probably would have placed better because I had a lot of experience on that track. And I've had been a lot further up the track, but we'll never know. I was happy with that result at the end of the day, because at the end of the day, pretty much all your goals had to go out the window for what you had. And it was what it was at the end of the day.
BEN WATERWORTH: I can imagine the mood must have been pretty foul over those Olympics after Nodar's death.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, well, I used to be on our team with the Small Nations for some training as well. Yeah, it was a shock. I think it was a shock as well, because people crash all the time in Luzh, but people don't pass away. So yeah, for us, it was a shock to the whole Luzh community. And then to also, Luzh kind of slips under the radar there, you know, with some of the Olympic sports. So for our sport to be such a major focus was, I don't know, quite overwhelming, I think. Yeah, and for me to be a focus of, you know, coming to the question for this media outlet and this and this and this, it was, yeah, I just kind of wanted to hide my hole. And it's one of the reasons why as well I left Vancouver early, because I just wanted to get over the whole thing.
BEN WATERWORTH: Which I can also imagine too, like as you're saying, like luge on paper is, it looks like a fairly dangerous sport, lots of crashes, lots of injuries and all that sort of stuff. But it's something that I think at the time they mentioned that it wasn't necessarily a high fatality sport. So I mean, had you experienced a fatality before? And when you see that, like, does that make you sort of question whether this should be something you should be doing anymore and kind of make you think a little bit differently about what you're doing?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: No, nobody had died in the sport since 1972, I think. Yeah, they got more fatalities in skiing, but then had more people compete in skiing. But I mean, at your top level, you've probably got... Yeah, it's hard to say. It was... No, it never made me rethink what I was doing because I knew I could side the track. But it definitely... Yeah, it just changed the whole tune. For a sport that has been going for many years and an international federation that really does try to look after their athletes, and we are a close-knit family, dysfunctional at times, I'm sure, like every family. It was sad to see the outside world forming their opinions on a sport they knew nothing about.
BEN WATERWORTH: It's because it is definitely one of those ones. You kind of think it's a lot more dangerous than it is, really. As you say, interesting here, there hadn't really been a fatality at that point, what, nearly 40 years. So it's very, very interesting. I mean, it was a freak accident, too. Most of these things are, right? Like it just kind of was a positioning and where he hit on the pole and everything. So sadly, unfortunately, these things can happen in a lot of sports, you know? Look what happened to, was it Phil Hughes in cricket? You know, things like that. You're never expecting these things are going to happen, and they do.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Exactly, exactly. And it kind of just put down to being an absolute freak accident.
BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah. So after Vancouver was, what happened from then? Was it looking at towards 2014? Did you keep competing? Kind of what happened post 2010?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So I kept competing. I did 2010-2011 season, 2011-2012 season. But then after 2012, I kept trying to train, but I had a complete burnout. Like my, just started losing my hair, and my body just said, enough's enough. I had to kind of really think about what I was doing. It was a really hard decision to make, but I had to make choice to get healthier. And yeah, my aim was 2014, but yeah, it is what it is. And it's funny, I went as a manager, a coach for Alex to 2014. And I stood, actually a year later after I retired, I stood on the track in Canicksay when I went on a holiday with my husband. And I said, I'm still on the side of the track and watched a few slides. And I was like, I'm actually really happy I'm standing right here, where I am instead of in that track. And that was good feeling. So it meant that it was the right choice to make. And I was never going to be able to get Olympic medals. So yeah, what was the... I'd probably achieved everything I was going to be able to achieve in the sport.
BEN WATERWORTH: And from that point on, as I mentioned earlier, you're now the president of Lose Australia. So was that kind of a transition straight away when you retired? Was it offered to you? Did you take it up? And then obviously now with Alex gunning for his third Olympics, was that just kind of the natural transition to then help someone like Alex with his Olympic ambitions?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So for me, it was just... Even when I was an athlete, I helped Alex out, like went to the Youth Olympics with him when I was still competing. And helped him out. That's always what I've wanted to do, is to help other athletes continue in the sport that I've loved and that I'm passionate about, and will continue to do so. I know that's exactly what Alex wants to do when he's finished as well. And I think he'd be amazing at it too. So it's nice to know that somebody... Yeah, you know, there's two types of athletes, the ones that will quit and then come back, and the others that want to help people and see how the people keep going. So I'm really, really happy to see that Alex is that type of person as well.
BEN WATERWORTH: So then, in your position, and so with Alex wanting to continue that, how do you attract the next generation of luge athletes, Hannah? We're gunning now for what? Is that five Olympics in a row where we're represented at luge? So you want to keep that torch alive. Hopefully Alex goes on to 2026, but where's the next Hannah? Where's the next Alex? Where are they coming from for 2030 and onwards?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: We do actually have another athlete who's 17, and he's coming up. He's going to be going for his first little season, but he's been training in America. So he'll be continuing, which is great. And you want to get them young as well. And then, yeah, he's really keen, and his family's really keen. And I think for us, when you want to get them young as well and do the junior circuit, it's a lot safer for them as well. But also, you've got to try and convince the parents. The parents have to be on board too. And there is this misconception that the sport is extremely dangerous. But yeah, like it's... And some of you might think that I'm saying for saying misconception, but yeah, you have to know more about the sport or compete in it to realise that it's a great sport and it's a great family. And I was thinking about it the other day, and I thought, oh, you know what? When my kids are about 15, if they haven't got another sporting interest, I'm just going to be like, right, you're going to try luge now. I'm not going to push you into it, but I've just decided it's a great family. And it was amazing the things that he just offered me to do in my life after sport. You know, on my master's degree, I got that funded from the IOC to do. I got selected out of six Olympians to do a master's. And that was an amazing opportunity. But also, you know, continuing on a lot of the friendships I've had, every time we've gone overseas and travelled, we've always visited somebody from the luge circuit and seen them caught up. I had to go to a meeting for luge in Slovenia a couple of years ago. I never would have gone to Slovenia before. I wouldn't, like, probably, you know, my ignorance, but I probably wouldn't have even known where it was. Same with Latvia. I didn't even know where it was. I was like, where's Latvia? What's this country? And it's one of my favourite countries in the world. And same with Slovenia, beautiful places. And I never would have had these opportunities to travel to had it not have been for my career in luge.
BEN WATERWORTH: If you were a swimmer or kept, you know, tennis, you know, just going to the UK, US, whoop-de-doo, but yeah, Slovenia, Latvia, great with that. Is it, I mean, is it a sport, like, when you're saying getting them young, like, is there a certain sports that you can keep an eye on certain athletes to try and entice them? Like, I know, like, say, you know, we spoke with Emma Lincoln-Smith a long time ago, and she sort of, you know, got the AIS letter, come and try out for skeleton, like, sort of that recruitment certain sports do for winter sports. Like, is that something, is there one sport that if some kids good at one sport, oh, let's transition over to luge?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Not really. Not for luge, I don't think. Because it's a sport for all shapes and sizes. Like, if you got on circuit, you see some are extremely tall, some are short, some are tubby, some are, you know, extremely tubby, some are really skinny. Yeah, it's really... And it's... Yeah, I don't think it is. It's just something that you kind of... You try and if you've got a bit of a natural knack for it. Whereas for skeleton, I know Michelle Steele was a beach sprinter, and so was Emma Lincoln Smith. And they've got that background in sprinting, where there was that transfer. Whereas, I mean, yeah, it would be good to have some shoulder strength, but...
BEN WATERWORTH: It's interesting to hear that, because it's like a lot of aerial skis, you know, Alyssa Campland, they were gymnasts, things like that. So yeah, it's sort of fascinating that there's kind of not that automatic transition, like you're not hanging around a basketball court or a soccer field always going, oh, that person there, that'd be a good loser. It's interesting. I can imagine it's a very hard sport to market. You're not just going down to the local primary school, going, hey, kids, come try luge.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: But that's pretty much what they do overseas.
BEN WATERWORTH: All those German ones where they're like, oh, cool, I can be like, you know, the Michael Phelps of Germany in luge. Australia, like, I mean, you're one of only three or four Australian, whoever compete in the Olympics in luge.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: So in Germany, they have a paid school. The government pays for a school program. So now we go off in sport in the junior school. We used to play soccer, t-ball or whatever. Or do athletics or play soccer. They go off and luge for four hours a week.
BEN WATERWORTH: So standard Tuesday in Germany, basically. They'll lose training to go after school today.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: And that's how it's all done from a government funding. They all have huge clubs within the same regions. So basically, their success in the sport is the success of this multiple layers of funding and performance training as well.
BEN WATERWORTH: It's fascinating, fascinating how different parts of the world obviously have these, you know, something so foreign to one country, and it's just a standard thing basically there. Hannah, before I let you go, obviously we've mentioned Alex a few times. And we're hoping to get him on the show, obviously in the lead up to Beijing. But what are your thoughts in, you know, we're obviously not that far away from the Winter Games. Does he, you have hopes for Alex kind of, you know, you're looking forward to going over and watching him compete, kind of like what's your sort of goals and hopes for Alex in the coming months in the lead up to Beijing?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Well, it's hard to say because of COVID, because last year, he was going to go over and do the season, but then he pulled the plug, which, you know, totally supported, given the current climate. And it wasn't, and same with like, you know, Bob Sane's skeleton. They didn't record any of the points towards the Olympics, because how could you? Their whole circuit wasn't there, and they basically, like the Americans, only did a few World Cups. And all the races were based in Europe. So it was hard to do. So he's had a year off, but Alex is an extremely talented athlete in luge. He's just born in the wrong country. So he's an extremely talented. He's got a lot of respect on the international circuit. And what's really great about our lovely luge family is he's got a lot of supporters as well from a lot of other countries who help him out because they can see he's got so much talent. And he also wants it as well. And what's been beautiful for me is I've seen him grow as an athlete. When I took him when he was 16 years old to the Youth Olympic Games in Innsbruck in 2012. And now I took him to 2014 Olympics, 2018. And now to 2022, it's just been so great seeing him grow as a human, but also as an athlete as well over those years. It's been really nice being a part of that all. And he's such a great person and a great athlete. And he's so dedicated to the sport, which is really nice to see. So I do have great hopes for him in the sport. But yeah, I guess we'll just have to see what this season holds for him. He's had some great results. We got 13th in the World Cup this season before, and he's got a lot of talent.
BEN WATERWORTH: Has he got the mo back? I always liked the look when he had the mo going, and he kind of had that sort of almost like a mop going on. I feel like he's like the fashionista of the Australian Winter Olympic team.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I used to tell him, you need to grow your fro out, and I saw him and he chopped it all off again, but I loved the fro. When he was 15, 16, when I first met him, he had this massive girly fro.
BEN WATERWORTH: I feel like there's some aerodynamics going on in facial hair. He could kind of grow it to a point where it would help sort of as you're going down the track. I don't know about the hair out of the helmet, but I don't know. Like, I mean, he's got a few months to go. He could work on something. He's scientifically, the AIS could help him out. I don't know.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: You wear visors, so I don't think it matters with the facial hair.
BEN WATERWORTH: There's ways of it.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: It's a good picture.
BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, exactly. I mean, the mullet's coming back. I mean, you know, he needs to have something, you know, like just whip off the helmet at the Olympics and put the flow, like get a sponsorship with Pantene or something like that. I don't know. Like I'm thinking of some things that can boost the sport, like, you know, spokesperson for Pantene, you know.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: I'm sure he'd be open to all suggestions.
BEN WATERWORTH: Yeah, absolutely. Hannah, thanks so much. It's been a lot of fun chatting with you today. Is there anything people listening today who maybe want to support or get behind Looz in Australia, like, is there a website, can they follow on social media, things like that they can do to support?
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Yeah, they can. There's social media, they can get in touch with us by our Facebook site if they're interested. And yeah, we'd love to hear from anyone who's interested in the sport, who wants to give it a go. Yeah, because we've got different pathways for the young ones and even the old ones, we can set up some club sliding for just those ones who've always wanted to try Looz.
BEN WATERWORTH: Great. Well, everyone listening right now, I want to hear from you in 20 years when you've heard this interview and you're competing at the Olympics, that this was the goal that got you there, because it has been a great chance to chat with you, Hannah, to learn a little bit more about this today, and best of luck with everything moving forward, and we appreciate your time on Off The Podium.
HANNAH CAMPBELL-PEGG: Thanks, Ben. It's been great.
BEN WATERWORTH: And a big thanks to Hannah there for her time. Great chat, great insight. Makes me want to take up luge, and also makes me a little bit intrigued to see how other sports have fared with Roy and HG's commentary over the years when it comes to the effect on the perception that us as Australians maybe have from these sports. So great insight there from Hannah, and we definitely thank her for her time on the show. We have lots more interviews coming your way over the coming weeks. We mentioned during our Tokyo coverage, we are aiming to try and bring you an interview every single week between now and of course the Beijing Olympics. And of course, a lot of those will be athletes in the lead up to Beijing. Of course, we also are gonna get some people on from Tokyo to talk about their experiences during Tokyo as well. So plenty to keep you covered. And outside of those interviews as well, we're looking at bringing you some other episodes, a Paralympics episode, hopefully. We'll have a preview, of course, of Pyeongchang. We've talked about doing some sports episodes and plenty of other things we have in the pipeline that we will hope you will stay tuned for. And you will stay tuned next week because our next interview is one of the best interviews I'm saying right now we have ever had on this show. This is a lot of fun. Ashley Werner, who is a bobsledder from Australia. Now, you probably remember us talking to Brianna Walker several months back about her monobob career and her hopes ahead of Beijing. And during that interview, you would remember us talking about her being cut from Pyeongchang at the last minute. There was a whole kerfuffle around qualification spots and everything along those lines, which basically saw Bri had a ticket to Pyeongchang. She had everything ready to go, but was cancelled last minute at her spot on that team. Now, her co-bobsledder that was also cut with her was Ashley. And Ash talks a little bit about that, but a lot more about her sort of bobsledding careers and her hopes ahead of Beijing. And it's such a fun chat. You will be in love with Ashley. She is such a fun, bubbly personality and such a fun, entertaining interview. I am not sugar-coating this or I'm not trying to oversell this or anything along those lines. I'm telling you now, you will thoroughly enjoy this chat. So that is next week, Ashley Werner. Stay tuned for that. In the meantime, if you wanna stay tuned to what else we've got going on on the show, like us on Facebook, follow us on Twitter and Instagram. Stay up to date with everything. We appreciate all the feedback and everything we get along those lines there. Of course, coming off the back of Tokyo, we've had a very busy last few weeks. So now we hope you're still on board and enjoying these interviews that we are bringing you along the way. And also, of course, remember to subscribe to our shows and all the good podcast channels, all the bad ones too. I'm sure there's some bad ones out there. You can hit subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Amazon Podcasts, you name it. We are there. And while you're there, why don't you leave some feedback? We'd love to hear what you think of the show. In the meantime, that's it for today. Thanks again to Hannah. Thanks for tuning in. Tune in next week for Ashley. And my name is Ben. This has been Off The Podium. Good night.
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